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The Misconstrued User Experience36:14 with Cat Noone
With something that is arguably the recipe to a product and company's success, it's interesting to see how two simple words can be misconstrued by so many. In this talk you'll be taken through where the confusion lies and the ingredients needed to create an experience people can't get enough of.
[MUSIC] 0:00 >> [APPLAUSE] >> Thanks. 0:12 Okay, cool. 0:18 This is set up. 0:19 >> Morning everyone. 0:20 Thanks for taking the time to sit here and 0:21 listen to me about babble on about all good things design. 0:24 Obviously, I'm Kat. 0:28 Please don't hate me. 0:31 I only included my Twitter and all that jazz here and on the last slide. 0:31 It won't be on the other ones. 0:35 So I'm sorry for that. 0:37 The misconstrued user experience. 0:40 Just an idea of what I'm gonna be talking about. 0:42 I think as a designer it's pretty obvious that there's this misconception 0:44 maybe to some about what user experience actually is. 0:49 And when I first started in design, it wasn't something I realized, because I 0:55 wasn't heavy in product design, getting nitty-gritty with apps and whatnot. 0:59 I was doing your basic, really botchy, 1:03 like early 2000 websites and graphic design and print, all that jazz. 1:07 And I guess I always had a really good idea of what a great experience was, 1:14 but it wasn't until this really monumental traumatic moment in an Italian 1:20 restaurant that I realized what user experience shouldn't be. 1:25 So that's what I'm gonna talk to you about and then go through 1:29 what user experience is not and is and how you can implement these certain things 1:35 into your product to ensure that it is as successful as it possibly can be. 1:40 Cool. 1:45 So, what is user experience? 1:47 Just to give you some background, I grew up In Brooklyn, New York in 1:52 the late 80's, 90's, and it was fantastic. 1:57 I'm from a Italian Irish background so we're all about experiences. 2:04 Played outside when I was younger, I knew that I had to come in for 2:10 dinner when the street lights came on and all was well in the world. 2:16 For me, the most, I guess, relevant and important still to this day experience for 2:23 me was sitting at the table, and I think you all can agree with this. 2:30 Sitting at the table with my family, having mealtime, whatever it was, 2:34 Sunday dinners were the most important, and having this conversation. 2:40 That was when we all got together. 2:45 The adults gossiped about what was going on in the neighborhood, and 2:47 we were asked what happened in school that day, or what have you. 2:51 And to me, that was always this really fantastic experience. 2:57 I got to connect with my family. 3:02 I got to enjoy really fantastic food and I always walked away from it happy. 3:06 There was never this, even when things went wrong or there were topics that were 3:16 discussed at the table, if I did something wrong, where it wasn't fantastic. 3:21 I always left the table knowing that I was loved. 3:27 That there was this unit that I could go back to. 3:31 And, that dinner would always be fantastic the next day. 3:35 So for me, I think that really played a large role in 3:41 how I really viewed user experience and just experiences in general. 3:46 Fast forward a few years, growing up in New York, so on and so 3:51 forth, the unthinkable happened. 3:55 I was told that we were moving to New Jersey. 3:58 And as a New Yorker, this was detrimental. 4:00 I had heard only horrible things about New Jersey. 4:04 From what I knew, 4:08 it was the red headed stepchild of the tri-state area that got no love. 4:09 New York obviously has this amazing rep for being New York. 4:14 Goes without saying. 4:18 Pennsylvania. 4:19 I mean they have Philly, they have The Steel City. 4:20 I mean it's nitty-gritty and then New Jersey all I knew was that 4:23 they had some grass and the shore and nothing fantastic. 4:26 So I was terrified. 4:30 The biggest thing that I remember thinking was that, 4:32 oh my goodness, they're not going to have Italian food. 4:36 So trying to reassure me, 4:40 my family did their best to look up places that they thought would spill 4:42 over into this Italian-Irish heritage, and when we moved there, 4:48 I decided I was going to check this one place out, this one restaurant. 4:53 We went, and one of the biggest, I guess you would say, call to actions, 5:01 or slogans, that they had, was they had the New York Slice. 5:07 I mean the pizza. 5:13 And that it was pure, authentic Italian food. 5:14 So okay. 5:17 We're in safe hands. 5:18 It's gonna be all right. 5:19 I went into the restaurant and right away the visuals were beautiful. 5:20 There were big paintings on the walls, photos of Italy and I said, 5:29 okay, everything seems all right. 5:33 Everything is gonna be fine. 5:36 We waited to be seated and nothing happen. 5:38 Nobody came up, nobody asked if we wanted to sit and in some restaurants apparently 5:42 that's a thing where they don't ask, okay fine, whatever. 5:45 They told us we could sit wherever we wanted to sit, without telling us you 5:49 that you actually had to go up and order your food before you sat down. 5:54 Again, not a big deal but it wasn't really communicated well. 5:59 So after sitting down, we realize that and we go back up and we order our food. 6:05 And we go through the line, we pick our food, we get to the cash register. 6:12 And we see the people taking the food out of these 6:16 really sloppy containers and just slapping it onto the plates. 6:21 And now I'm starting to panic again because to me, 6:26 this is really not how it's done. 6:29 In terms of my expectations, 6:32 how they advertised themselves, the way they presented it. 6:35 And the idea that I had in my head of what a true Italian 6:40 restaurant from true Italian culture was, this was not it. 6:45 Again, whatever. 6:50 Go with the flow. 6:51 We get our food. 6:54 We go back to the tables. 6:56 And we realize there's no forks and knives on the table so 6:58 we said okay, where are they? 7:02 And they said oh you actually have to get up and 7:05 go to the other end of the restaurant and get your forks and knives and 7:06 your utensils. 7:09 I'm like, what the fuck? 7:10 So we go and we get the forks and the knives and we go back down to eat. 7:13 And the one great thing that was happening in the restaurant at the time, 7:19 was that they had an Italian soccer game on, or football, 7:24 sorry, football game on, so that was okay. 7:27 But the more and more I got through the experience, 7:32 that entire time at the restaurant, I think everyone can agree that it's not 7:35 even really what you expect from a restaurant. 7:39 You expect to go in, you expect to be seated. 7:43 You expect to essentially be, I don't wanna say catered to, but in a way, 7:46 that is the reason you go out and you have people cook for 7:51 you, because you don't want to cook yourself. 7:55 So you know all these expectations weren't being met and 7:58 still at the end of it, the core reason we were there was for the food. 8:03 I absolutely love food. 8:09 I am a velociraptor when it comes to eating. 8:11 I love it. 8:14 So no matter what, the purpose here was to actually feed myself, 8:15 and I knew that I was gonna sit down, and I was gonna have the meal. 8:21 I did. I was having pasta with meatballs, 8:27 and I cut into the meatball, and it was raw. 8:31 And I said, all right, I'm done. 8:36 This is it. 8:38 For me that problem that I was looking to have solved, feeding myself and 8:41 actually enjoying it was not happening at all. 8:46 From the minute I stepped into the restaurant to the minute I stuck my fork 8:50 in the food, it just was not blowing my mind at all. 8:53 And before I even went to the restaurant you know, part of me was terrified. 8:59 I didn't know if this was going to solve my needs but 9:06 from what I understood there was nothing better out there so I went with it. 9:13 And I feel like that happens more often than not. 9:20 So at one point I choked up to the fact that it was just New Jersey and 9:24 they didn't know how to make Italian food. 9:27 And I figured that I'd try something else, because there's always something else. 9:28 I just hadn't realized it yet and I was a bit naive, a tad. 9:34 So, you know, after that I had this idea in my head, and I really saw 9:41 what it was that you didn't want from an experience. 9:49 This wasn't what I was used to. 9:54 This was my first experience in this state at a restaurant after moving. 9:55 I'm in high school I mean it's super, 10:01 it's just everyone likes impressions and that wasn't a fantastic one. 10:04 And even though I wasn't you know, super embedded into design yet like I said. 10:10 I knew that you can't possibly expect people who come to you for 10:16 experiences, to be okay with taking this away from it. 10:22 And from there, I vowed to never put anyone 10:28 using anything I made or that they would touch through that horrible experience. 10:33 And I've taken that approach on every product that I've touched or 10:38 I've at least tried to. 10:44 I can't say that I've always been successful for more reasons than one, 10:45 but I've always tried to embed that into my work. 10:51 With that said, [LAUGH] I'm gonna take you through, 10:58 just a little of where I found that kind of embeds itself and 11:01 applies, when it comes to making your products. 11:06 Bottom line, it's about Understanding the user. 11:13 It's all about their needs. 11:16 Whether it's providing them with high quality food when you say it is. 11:19 If you say it's fast food, then by all means, I expect a quick and dirty meal. 11:23 I expect to be sick after it, but I know what I'm getting for my money. 11:28 When you advertise something as high quality, beautiful, 11:35 traditional, I expect the image that I have in my head. 11:40 Not only based off the image that I have in my head and past experiences, but 11:46 what you're advertising to me. 11:50 And if you truly don't understand 11:52 the audience you're catering to, and what they need from you, 11:56 there's no possible way you can actually delivery a high quality product. 12:00 It's impossible. 12:05 So, whether that's actually doing, 12:06 you know your own research by polling a survey, going out into the field 12:09 if its a restaurant that you're opening up and going into this one neighborhood where 12:15 the people there would more than likely use your restaurant, use your services. 12:20 These are all ways that you can truly get a grasp of what your target 12:25 audience wants and needs. 12:29 The Concept. 12:35 I think this is by far 12:35 the easiest aspect of actually building a product, is coming up with 12:38 that initial concept because it's usually this aha moment that you have. 12:43 I think someone said yesterday that it doesn't even really happen 12:48 when you're in front of a computer or device or something. 12:52 It's this random moment and you usually, it spirals. 12:55 You go from there, you build on this concept, and the rest is history. 12:58 Whether or not it works, again, is a totally different story. 13:04 But the initial concept to get to beginning to end is usually pretty solid. 13:07 Or it gets there at some point. 13:14 Again, this is in no specific order but here we go. 13:21 Interaction Design. 13:25 I think people forget sometimes and this is designers, 13:30 developers, whoever, that there are people using the product. 13:36 There are people on the other end of the screen. 13:41 So these interactions that are embedded into the product 13:44 are extremely important from 13:48 the big details to the little ones that actually end up making a huge difference. 13:55 The way that someone interacts with your product is the core of it, more so 14:01 than the actual concept. 14:05 Again, that's irrelevant at this point. 14:07 Now the main issue is how they're going to navigate through it, 14:10 how they're going to interact with it. 14:13 Those dark screens that you forget about, 14:16 those are the ones that really need paying attention to. 14:19 Visual Design, this, I think I can't press enough, 14:26 needs to be the last thing you do when it comes to creating a product. 14:31 I think having an idea of course of what you want it to look like and 14:40 how beautiful you want it to be while creating it is vital but 14:45 it is the last piece of the puzzle when it comes to creating your product. 14:52 You know a lot of designers, 14:58 mainly ones that are early on, have this misconception that in order for 15:01 a product to be absolutely mind blowing, it has to knock someone's socks off. 15:07 Visually, when it comes to the beautiful colors and pushing pixels and so on and 15:13 so forth. 15:18 And, that's not the case. 15:19 This is the last piece of the puzzle when it comes 15:20 to everything that goes into actually creating your product. 15:24 Yes, it is vital, but there are plenty of other things that are actually vital 15:28 when it comes to creating a product, from copy, to again, the navigation, so 15:33 on and so forth. 15:37 Tell a detailed story a user becomes engrossed in. 15:44 Stories, whether you're working on print design all the way to actually 15:48 creating an app for iOS or Android or whatever, stories are everything. 15:54 They're what keep us there. 15:59 They're what engage us. 16:02 They're what keep us coming back for more. 16:04 They're what allow us to actually get lost in your product in a good way. 16:06 It engages us. 16:14 And it allows us to actually become attached to who you are. 16:16 To your story. 16:22 I think the best products that exist are the ones who have a background. 16:25 Have something for us to become attached to. 16:30 Have beautiful and understandable and clear copy that enabled me or 16:34 us to really associate with it and 16:40 truly understand why we came to, or us, or whatever, for your product. 16:45 Why we came to versus the other products that are out there. 16:51 Because there are plenty of products that are in every space. 16:56 That do one thing over the other. 17:00 You know, maybe it's a truncated version of a product, you know a smaller one with 17:02 more basic features versus another one that is a bit bulkier. 17:06 But I can guarantee you the one that communicates much better with the users, 17:11 that tells a much better story and gives you a much better background in 17:16 understanding of what it is you need as a user is the one that will win every time. 17:21 Marketing, this again falls right in line with the engaging story. 17:30 And under marketing, it's your communications. 17:36 It's arguably your customer service as well. 17:40 It's the copy in your app or your website or whatever. 17:44 It's the way you market your brand to others compared to 17:48 the other products that are in your space. 17:52 I think there are a lot of products that forget 17:56 to actually provide content on a blog, to provide these self-help blog posts or 18:03 educational, whatever you want to call it, content on their blog for their users. 18:10 For something like LayerVault, who unfortunately is no longer around soon, 18:16 for them, design posts or how to 18:22 design certain things would be crucial to the users who actually use their product. 18:26 For Sketch and Photoshop, the same thing. 18:34 For an app like productivity, producing content around holidays, 18:38 on how they can actually, how you can use their product to get through the holidays 18:45 productively, is how you actually succeed. 18:50 Helping your users achieve the goal they even came to your product for 18:55 in the first place. 18:59 Making them feel like they're successful. 19:00 Making the copy very clear and understanding. 19:02 That all falls into marketing. 19:06 Pricing. 19:13 If you're a charity app don't charge. 19:15 You know? 19:22 It's these certain things that you just should and should not do. 19:23 If you are a app for people who just, 19:30 you know women who just had babies or people that just grew their family. 19:35 Don't charge an arm and a leg for 19:40 your product because odds are likely that they're just ridiculously 19:42 underwater as it is with the welcoming of their new baby or babies. 19:46 I think this also goes back to understanding the users' needs, 19:52 what they expect from you, what they need in the first place. 19:56 And using that to determine your price point. 20:00 I was just having a conversation yesterday about WhatsApp. 20:05 And we discussed how people forget that WhatsApp actually 20:10 charges $0.99 for every download per year, or something like that. 20:15 That's a lot of money, when you think about how many users they actually have. 20:21 But for the purpose they're serving, what they're providing you with, 20:25 I think $0.99 is really reasonable. 20:30 They're giving you a product that you can actually now make calls on if you 20:33 have data, that you can message with seamlessly. 20:36 By far next to Facebook's actual messenger platform, 20:39 it is by far one of the best messaging apps I've ever used. 20:44 And doesn't really compare to something like iMessage where you'd expect something 20:50 but they really can't get their shit together, iMessage. 20:54 Everything is just horrible. 20:58 You switch to a different product and you expect this continuity. 21:00 And don't get me wrong, I'm an Apple user to the core. 21:03 But you expect this continuity on every product that you pick up and 21:06 to pick up where you first left off, but that doesn't happen. 21:10 Because it goes haywire with messages from, like, last week, and 21:15 spits you out messages from today. 21:19 And you just have no idea what the hell is going on. 21:21 So for WhatsApp to charge you $0.99 to do everything that 21:24 iMessage does plus more technically, I think that's fair. 21:30 So understanding the users who will actually interact with your product and 21:35 what they need from you can help you really determine the price point. 21:41 Customer service. 21:49 All it takes is one sad face to make your company look like douchewaffles. 21:50 I promise you that. 21:54 Working on the products that I have, I have never learned so 21:57 much more than what I have when it comes to customer service. 22:02 Building a startup and co-founding one, I've interacted heavily 22:06 with the users, and that's because you wear many hats, and that's okay. 22:14 But I realized how easy it is for 22:20 them to become extremely irritated, and they have a right to. 22:24 If something wasn't very clear, 22:29 if we didn't communicate something very well, if there's a misunderstanding, 22:32 if something completely broke in the middle of them using it, It happens. 22:37 People get aggravated or frustrated, what have you. 22:43 But people are actually more understanding than you think, 22:47 especially when you have a freebie or fremium product. 22:50 They understand even when you say you're in some type of private beta or 22:54 that you're building things, but you have to communicate that. 22:59 That you're in the process of building and they want to help you get 23:03 there because they really love the product and they were able to connect to it, 23:07 cuz you told a really engaging story and they know your background. 23:10 So when they email you about whatever it is that just broke. 23:18 There needs to be this understanding from your side 23:23 that they came to you because they thought you'd solve the problem they were 23:27 looking to have solved in the first place. 23:31 And something went terribly wrong. 23:34 So for you to go back and say I can't help you, or 23:37 to not answer them for a week at a time. 23:42 You can understand if someone loses their shit. 23:45 It's completely understandable and I, even though I worked on several products, 23:49 do as well if I don't get an answer from a company because I expect this. 23:53 This comes with running a company and it comes, that's part of your job. 23:59 And probably out of everything the most important, 24:04 because these are the people using your product. 24:09 And if they stop using it or they go tell someone that you don't answer, or 24:11 that you're not compliant or 24:15 you're not helpful, that domino effect can be horrible. 24:17 And at the end of the day it's not worth it. 24:23 Much like your employees or your coworkers or whatever, 24:25 you guys are the ones who are actually building the product, which is wonderful. 24:29 You play such an important role, but 24:33 these are the ones you're actually building it for. 24:35 So why not give them that respect? 24:38 Create a company culture that encompasses user experience. 24:44 I think the best companies that exist are the ones that are not design driven and 24:49 they're not data driven and they're not tech driven, they're experience driven. 24:53 There's this understanding between all of these sections of 25:00 the company that everyone understands that in order to 25:04 actually succeed everyone needs to really work together. 25:09 So when I was at that restaurant, 25:16 there wasn't this understanding that their 25:19 goal was to provide their users, or their diners, 25:25 if you will, with the best experience. 25:30 They knew from the get go that they were bullshitting, 25:35 when they said that they are traditional Italian food. 25:39 They knew that the culture that they've created 25:43 was not one that was anything close to what you'd get if you went to Italy or 25:48 you went into a true Italian household. 25:53 And it's just not how it works. 26:01 This wasn't something that was embedded. 26:03 From the beginning, they knew they wanted to open a restaurant. 26:05 They knew that they were going to serve Italian food. 26:09 They knew that they were gonna 26:11 throw this site up there because it would attract users. 26:14 It's like clickbait for restaurants, and that's not how it works. 26:16 Companies that really embed this from the beginning and have this goal to create 26:22 this all-around fantastic user experience are the ones that really succeed, 26:28 because there is no competition among tech and among design and among data. 26:34 And I think when there is this mutual respect, 26:38 you really see super amounts of success. 26:41 I cannot stress this enough. 26:47 And it pains me when designers kinda put themselves on a high horse. 26:50 A design team is not a team of only designers. 26:58 That's not how it works. 27:02 I think we as designers have a super important role. 27:07 But the designing of the product, and 27:14 that includes service design, that's marketing design. 27:18 All of that plays a role in the success of the product. 27:24 So if you actually think that you are the sole reason, as the visual designer or 27:29 the one who's prototyping, whatever you want to call yourself. 27:36 It's all just labels, you're a designer. 27:38 If you think you are the sole reason this product succeeds you need to find 27:42 a different job. 27:47 Because you will be the reason the product fails. 27:50 I think engineers are just as crucial to the success of a company and 27:55 the marketers and the sales. 28:01 And that backend engineer or 28:04 the Windows engineer who that doesn't get that much love because realistically, 28:06 all of the love is poured into iOS and Android and so on and so forth. 28:12 Everyone plays a role and it's so important. 28:17 Designers, I absolutely love my job. 28:19 I love what I do, and I love being a designer, and 28:22 being part of this community. 28:25 But it's super important that we understand that. 28:26 And there's this mutual respect for the engineers who take what you've created and 28:30 make it functional. 28:34 Because realistically, a design is not complete, it's not complete period for 28:36 a long time, and it continues to evolve. 28:39 But they take what you've created visually and they make it so 28:42 that it can actually be put in the App Store, they make it functional. 28:45 It needs to be beautiful and it needs to be functional, and if you can't code, 28:49 they need to, so you need them as much as they need you. 28:53 The job doesn't end after the product is shipped. 29:00 I think a lot of people, product owners, product managers, 29:05 cofounders, whatever you want to call it. 29:11 People who are making products forget that 29:14 design has to evolve, and iteration needs to happen. 29:20 And this is where data comes along. 29:26 This is where you actually test what you've put out there. 29:30 I'm not saying that you should test 300 different colors of blue. 29:36 But realistic testing that benefits the product and 29:42 allows you to iterate quickly and efficiently. 29:46 There's a number of products out there that enable you to do so, 29:52 even if it's just Google Analytics Take a look at the results and 29:58 how people are interacting with your product. 30:04 See what when wrong when it came to your assumptions because realistically, 30:09 there are, as much research as you do before, 30:14 there are assumptions that are made when building a product. 30:18 See what assumptions worked and what didn't, where things are failing and 30:22 where things aren't. 30:27 If a feature's not being used for x amount of time, kill it. 30:28 It's not worth the resources if nobody's using it. 30:32 And your time can be better spent elsewhere. 30:35 Providing your users with a much better experience for 30:39 the things that they actually need in the product. 30:42 But understand that 30:44 once your work gets handed to the engineers, we're so going forward. 30:48 Once the product's actually shipped, designers and engineers need to so 30:53 do their homework to see how things are working. 30:58 This is big. 31:07 I think this slide can actually be a talk all 31:11 on its own when it comes to shipping products. 31:15 So I'm not gonna go in to deep detail. 31:20 But I think there's also a misconception about what happens 31:22 when things are shipped and what needs to be shipped and so on and so forth. 31:28 I think it's okay to ship something that's not mind-blowingly 31:33 beautiful as an Apple Watch or the iPhone or whatever. 31:38 I think that's okay. 31:44 I think it's not okay and I think it's irresponsible to ship something that has 31:47 very tricky privacy settings that can really screw with someone using product. 31:52 I think that's the irresponsible side of things. 32:01 And I think that is the shit that I refer to when I say it's called ship not shit. 32:03 Those are the things that you don't want to do. 32:12 Those are the things that you shouldn't be doing. 32:15 It's your duty to ensure that when that product gets shipped, 32:18 it does provide the user with exactly what they're coming to you in the first place. 32:22 No, maybe it won't have everything your road map is set out to provide for 32:26 the next year and a half or two years. 32:30 And that's okay too. 32:33 Because it's unrealistic to think you're going to build everything 32:33 within three months. 32:36 You will pull your hair out. 32:37 And it just can't happen, unless you're not sleeping. 32:39 But take the time to really think about what needs to go into that initial build 32:46 the first time a user interacts with your product or the second time or whatever. 32:53 There are certain things, like I said, that don't need to be in there, but 32:58 others, be responsible. 33:02 Make sure that no matter what's in there, no matter what features, even if 33:05 it's the most basic, that they have a fantastic experience every single time. 33:09 A great user experience is the craft that brings all of the elements together 33:18 to create one consistent feeling for the user. 33:22 Again yesterday, I had a conversation about products, as expected. 33:26 And we were talking about Twitter and how there are certain 33:31 apps that they have on certain platforms like the Mac 33:36 app that don't get nearly as much love as the other ones. 33:41 And whether you're using iOS, whether you're using Android, whether you're using 33:45 Mac, TweetDeck, whatever, there's a slew of different experiences on everything. 33:50 It's so damned confusing. 33:55 Yes, I still use the Mac app because I hate every single other product out there, 33:58 so I'm kind of stuck. 34:02 But their job is to provided a consistent feeling for 34:06 me every single time I use their product. 34:08 And sometimes companies are so big that they feel that they don't have to do that, 34:12 and they have their reasons and whatever. 34:15 But a really great user experience does that, there's one consistent feeling. 34:18 At the end of the day, user experience is not about wire frames. 34:26 It's not about prototypes. 34:32 It's not about whether you call yourself a UX designer or 34:36 a prototype designer in interaction. 34:40 It doesn't matter. 34:43 User experience is not any of those things. 34:46 It's not about what we think, it's not about the assumptions we make. 34:49 At the end of the day, user experience is about what you feel, bottom line. 34:55 And if people are not walking away from your product feeling absolutely amazing, 35:00 feeling that the problem that they came to you and sometimes paid for you to solve 35:05 are not being met, then you're not providing a good user experience. 35:10 And I think if we really take the time, those little extra minutes, 35:14 to focus on those little details and that really welcoming copy. 35:21 And try to provide people with the expectations they have for 35:26 something like this, then we should. 35:32 Because, when people hold you in high regard as a company, 35:35 or as a product, that's amazing. 35:38 And if you can meet them on the pedestal that they've put you on, 35:41 you by far, have the market. 35:46 You have it. 35:49 It's success. 35:49 There's nothing better. 35:51 So at the end of the day, yeah, user experience is not what you think. 35:53 It's about what you feel. 35:57 And I think that's the most important part. 35:58 Thank you. 36:00 >> [APPLAUSE] 36:03 [MUSIC] 36:07
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