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[MUSIC]

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Welcome, everybody.

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So excited to have you all here today.

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I am Ryan Carson, the founder of Treehouse
and I would like to welcome you to this

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new, guest speaker series
How To Land Your Dream Job.

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In this series, we will talk with
seasoned tech professionals about

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their journey that got them
to where they are today.

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Through our conversations we will
explore the idea of a dream job.

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So you're able to set expectations,
goals and aspirations to succeed.

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We hope this series helps
you realize how important

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all professional experience
is towards your goals.

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Stay tuned for after the interview,
as there will be a networking hour for

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all attendees where you will get the
chance to meet other folks in real time.

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I'm very happy to introduce Will Vasquez
as this sessions guest speaker.

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Will's a software developer at Task It and
an instructor at UCLA coding bootcamp.

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He made the shift from management to
software development after graduating

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from a coding bootcamp in 2015.

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He was inspired to make that change
after founding a startup in Peru.

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Currently holds a Master
of Business Administration

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from Universidad del Pacifico in Peru and

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a Bachelors of Science in Economics
from Ramapo College of New Jersey.

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Will is a messy like soccer player, I
want verification of that by the way, and

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the father of a two year old and
has surprising cooking abilities.

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Welcome, Will.

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>> Thanks, Ryan, thank you very much for
having me on your on your series.

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>> Yeah, it's good to have you here.

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Really appreciate your time.

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So let's get started and
get right into the questions.

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We know that a computer science
degree isn't the only route

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to a meaningful tech career.

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I'd like to invite you to expand about
your background and experience that

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led you to your role as a software
developer, and bootcamp instructor.

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When did you first consider software
engineering as a viable option?

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>> Sure, so I always had a love for

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technology, that there was
definitely a passion there.

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I did do my career in economics because
my parents gave me that choice between

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studying economics they'll pay for it, or
doing computer science at the time and

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then I would have to fend for
myself on that one.

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So I did go with the safe choice, did
economics, then I did a master's degree.

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I founded a startup and at the startup
I kind of had to wear a lot of hats and

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one of them was trying to figure
out how to launch the product.

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So I learned a little bit self taught,

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some self taught was a couple
of courses here and there.

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And that's where I saw that,
that's what I really liked.

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Starting to work out,
sold it 2014 came back to the States, and

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that's where I went into a bootcamp.

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I took a bootcamp in, it was a Roberts
coding bootcamp at the time, I believe.

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And from there, yeah, I did a 360
degree pivot into software development.

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One of the important things is trying
to use kind of my previous skills

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through the startup at
the time I was working for,

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but as I was taking
the bootcamp was part time.

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I was also working full time, right?

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And I was using my management skills there
as I was working there as a supply chain

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management manager.

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So I used all those skills to be able
to help me pivot towards development.

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>> So that bootcamp,
was it online or in person?

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>> That one was in person.

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>> Got it.
So how did you balance,

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that sounds like a lot of work,
kind of balancing that job being

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a family person and during the bootcamp.

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What was the typical day for you when
you were going through the bootcamp?

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>> So the bootcamp was three times a week.

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But of course you had homeworks for the
other days that you didn't have classes.

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One of the things was actually scheduling.

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One of the things I've gotten a little bit
better was trying to schedule your time.

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Just to focus on what's being,
what you wanna concentrate,

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what you wanna get done during the day.

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So mostly your nine to five, and then
from there, I would probably set a fixed

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amount of time to be able to dedicate
just do my homework or head class.

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>> Got it, okay.

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So why don't you talk about,
what advice you could give for

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aspiring developers who are specifically,
transitioning sectors like you did.

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>> So the first thing is,
if you're doing a career change,

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everything that you've done up to
that point has some value, right?

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You can't just turn away,
I know you're starting a new career, but

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that doesn't mean that you
start on a blank canvas.

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So you're a teacher, you leverage that
knowledge that you have from teaching.

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Because if you want to do there's
a lot of companies that are trying

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in the education sector.

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Or, for example, I had somebody
that says I'm now teaching at UCLA,

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I had a student that, for
example, he was a cook.

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He was a chef.

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So using that and

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then he ended up working in a startup that
had to do with one of those kitchens.

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But again, leveraging the knowledge that
you had before to be able to help you

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kinda transition into development.

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>> Got it, okay.

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So what suggestions do you have for

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formatting a resume as a new developer for
someone who has no tech experience?

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>> So all right, so
depends how you're going.

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So the resume is gonna be tailored
of how you're gonna apply.

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So if you are gonna try that
kinda like a shotgun approach or

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just try to shoot to one of these
LinkedIns or Monsters or whatnot.

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There, you probably want you're gonna look
at any job description that you have.

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You're gonna want to try to load your
application which is many of the keywords

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as possible.

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So if you're looking at a entry level
position for a junior front end developer,

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you're probably gonna wanna load
your resume with JavaScript.

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So your project has JavaScript and
you use JavaScript here, right.

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So you wanna load it because most of
the time, these systems LinkedIn Monsters,

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they go through kind of a AI system I'll
just read your resume and just kind of

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rank you depending how you score,
on the keywords that they're ranking for.

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So that's one one way of
looking at your resume.

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Now if you're looking at your resume view,
and

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this is probably the best way you're kind
of your best shot is networking and if you

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are able to reach out actual person, then
you probably want to tailor your resume.

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If you're making this transition,
you wanna highlight your projects.

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You wanna highlight that, yeah,
you might not have the working experience

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because you just came out of, learning and
self taught or bootcamp, right.

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So you don't have the experience
in the workforce.

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But in the case of development,

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you can show that you have
experienced by doing, right?

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I think this is one of the the big
advantage compared to other careers,

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right?.

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Because an accountant can say that
he's done some accounting but

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there's really harder way to prove that,
right?

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But in case of our careers, in case of
development, you can be a great developer

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if you show that you've been
able to work on projects, right?

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So links to your repositories,
links to your work to your projects.

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One of the biggest things that I've seen
is you don't have to have 20 projects.

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You can have two or three projects but
you gotta finish projects.

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I've seen a lot of resumes where they'll
put a couple of projects on there, but

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they're not complete, right?

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They're not complete and
they're halfway done.

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And that unluckily says a lot, right?

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That unluckily says kind of,
that it says a lot more than they needed.

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>> So how if you've got two or
three great projects,

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and this is one of the reasons we focus
on projects in the tech degree and

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why you focus on projects,
I'm sure you're coding boot camp.

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Once you've built that and and
shipped it, how important is it for

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it to live live on the web,
on a real URL and to be working?

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Is that super important or is it more
about the the link to the repo or

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is it both?

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>> Well, so I think it's more about, if
you're sharing your resume, like a printed

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resume, it's gonna be really hard for
somebody to type a really long, right.

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If you go to one of the,
if you deploy this to Heroku or

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some free service, it's gonna be
really hard to, a 200 long URL,

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it's gonna be really hard for
the presenter.

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So I would recommend, I do like a Bitly,
which will kind of shorten your URL.

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Ideally, if you can,
you can deploy it to an actual domain,

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again, it's always those little
things that add up, right?

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Cuz they keep saying this person is, you
don't say that you are detail oriented,

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you are actually showing
with these little things,

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that you actually are detailed oriented,
right?

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>> Yep, that's a really good point.

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That's almost like a filter that
person that does the first pass

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in your resume is gonna be checking and

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I would say I agree with that,
that's the first thing to do.

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You're gonna either click it or type it.

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It has to be short.

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Ideally, it's a professional looking URL.

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You can purchase a low
cost domain name for

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very little money as long as it's a word
or a group of words that makes sense.

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It can be a .IO,
it can be a dot, whatever.

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And putting your project
there says it does say a lot.

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And that it works and that so

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if folks are developers, they're not
gonna be necessarily UX designers.

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So how do you deal with making the app

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look great part of this Yeah,
yeah, I do agree.

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So I'm really bad at design,
my stuff looks horrendous, right.

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>> [LAUGH]
>> You gotta accept it, first place.

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You gotta look at your thing and
be like yeah, this, [INAUDIBLE].

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>> [LAUGH]
>> One way that I try to circumvent that,

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one way that I try to find the difference,
is sometimes finding themes.

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There's nothing wrong
with with finding themes.

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If you're doing something that's a form or
something like that,

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off the top of my head I don't
remember any of these websites.

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But you can find one of these theme
websites, a guy that will do it for free,

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sometimes they cost a little bit
of money 10 bucks, 12 bucks.

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Buy theme cuz that's what I do, cuz again,
I am not good at design, right.

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But it is important, especially when
you're kind of on the job hunt.

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Kind of like food, right,
food can taste amazing, but

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if it doesn't look presentable,
you kind of have that hesitation to try.

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>> Yeah, it's no good.

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>> Right.

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>> Yep.
>> Yeah.

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>> I hear ya.

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>> So yeah, I would definitely think about
making it look, at least presentable.

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Or again, you can also use some of
these other tools, like Bootstrap.

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>> Any of [INAUDIBLE],
right.

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>> Yeah, and then the CSS frameworks.

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>> Yeah, I think what Will is saying,
and I would echo to all of you

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joining us is that, just imagine you're
walking in the door to an interview.

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You would care about how you looked,
you would brush your teeth,

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you would kind of do these things.

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And it's very similar,

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the first impression that
someone's gonna have of your work.

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You just need to make it look like
you thought about that, right.

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And so, Will, do you think,
we'll go a little off script here.

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Walk us through, just step by step,
how does someone get a job?

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So you've completed your tech degree or

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you've completed your boot camp, but
you don't have any paid experience.

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Just walk someone through,
tactically, step by step,

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how they're gonna get those interviews and
then land that first job.

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>> Yeah, so the first thing,
I'm a big data guy, so

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the first thing is you wanna kind
of have some type of structure.

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So think of how you're gonna
apply that to the process.

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Describing a simple Google sheets or
Excel spreadsheet and kind of being like,

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where you've applied, what happened, and
then just keeping track of the results.

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Because one of the things is you wanna
learn through the process, right,

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especially If you get interviews.

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If you don't get anything, well,

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you can keep trying to tweak
it until you get interviews.

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But if you get interviews and you want
to learn from the things that you didn't

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answer, right, so you want to keep some
some way of trackable information.

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So the first thing is working
on your resume, right, I think.

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I guess I would have two resumes,
one that you're gonna kind of shoot out to

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some of these sites,
like the Monster and those.

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And then one that you'll be able
to send to your network, right,

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so that's the first thing.

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You have to have that, have projects.

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Of course, these things can
be done in parallel, right,

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you want to have your projects,
like we talked about,

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we want to have them working, deployed.

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One thing that a lot of people forget
is go to the GitHub repositories.

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We are developers, so some people
will check and know about GitHub.

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So yes,
your page can look really nice, but

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some people will go to
the repo to see the code.

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So adding comments to your code,
making the Read Me,

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adding some information, not everybody's
gonna sign up to your account.

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So just put a dummy account there so
people just when they look at your site,

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they can try it out and
they have a dummy login.

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So this is more maintenance right there's
the first thing before you jump into

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00:13:24,935 --> 00:13:28,250
the actually looking for a job.

225
00:13:29,400 --> 00:13:32,240
The next process would be the search.

226
00:13:32,240 --> 00:13:35,830
I would apply to any jobs that,
if you're a junior developer right,

227
00:13:35,830 --> 00:13:40,870
going to try to get your first job,
anything below two years is pretty good.

228
00:13:40,870 --> 00:13:42,940
>> Right.
>> A lot of companies have an idea of what

229
00:13:42,940 --> 00:13:47,640
they want, but they put two years, and two
years is a good cut off to apply to a job.

230
00:13:47,640 --> 00:13:50,720
>> It it says two years
do you go less than two?

231
00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:53,855
>> Yes, two years and below.

232
00:13:53,855 --> 00:13:56,160
>> Yeah, yeah,
less than equal to two years.

233
00:13:56,160 --> 00:14:00,954
Yeah, definitely,
you have a really good shot there,

234
00:14:00,954 --> 00:14:03,520
above two years it's gonna
be a little bit harder.

235
00:14:05,070 --> 00:14:09,250
Keyword search, right, when you're looking
through, if you're looking at LinkedIn,

236
00:14:09,250 --> 00:14:12,890
they have like this keyword option that
you can kind of pick out keywords.

237
00:14:12,890 --> 00:14:16,830
So you want to look for front end
developer, separate, together, cuz again,

238
00:14:16,830 --> 00:14:20,830
a lot of people load these sites and
they will write front end separate,

239
00:14:20,830 --> 00:14:23,640
they'll write it together,
they'll write it with a dash.

240
00:14:23,640 --> 00:14:27,800
So try a lot of combinations of these cuz
you'll probably get different results.

241
00:14:29,480 --> 00:14:31,470
So now you have your pregame,

242
00:14:31,470 --> 00:14:35,220
kind of have your searches, so
you have the shotgun style,

243
00:14:35,220 --> 00:14:39,130
which is just applying to all of them,
which is kind of spraying and praying.

244
00:14:39,130 --> 00:14:43,360
>> So how many do you need to have
on your list to start the process,

245
00:14:43,360 --> 00:14:44,190
how many companies?

246
00:14:46,150 --> 00:14:47,730
>> Well, so if you're doing spraying and

247
00:14:47,730 --> 00:14:50,520
praying, that's kind of like
just praying for the best.

248
00:14:50,520 --> 00:14:54,000
But the next would be,
what are your ideal companies,

249
00:14:54,000 --> 00:14:56,250
right, or ideal type of companies?

250
00:14:56,250 --> 00:15:00,150
And there are the ones where you're
goNNA probably put your most effort.

251
00:15:00,150 --> 00:15:04,500
And there you want to research
the company, research who did it,

252
00:15:04,500 --> 00:15:07,530
if you can find the developers,
If you can find leads.

253
00:15:07,530 --> 00:15:12,520
And I I've done this,
it does work, not with everybody,

254
00:15:12,520 --> 00:15:16,050
but it does work,
cold emailing them, right.

255
00:15:16,050 --> 00:15:19,085
But just not cold emailing them,
here's my job,

256
00:15:19,085 --> 00:15:24,140
you've got to kind of
sketch out a good email.

257
00:15:24,140 --> 00:15:29,900
Why do you like the company,
why you think you're a good fit, right?

258
00:15:29,900 --> 00:15:32,100
And if you have some similar product or

259
00:15:32,100 --> 00:15:35,360
some similar projects to that company,
that's a great place to show it there and

260
00:15:35,360 --> 00:15:37,530
be like, listen,
this is what I did, right.

261
00:15:37,530 --> 00:15:41,730
That a great way of kind of
getting your foot in the door.

262
00:15:41,730 --> 00:15:44,320
>> Got it.
>> And the last one is network.

263
00:15:44,320 --> 00:15:48,206
>> Okay,
>> There is,

264
00:15:48,206 --> 00:15:52,608
the way that I've been able to kind of go
through the process has been networking.

265
00:15:52,608 --> 00:15:55,365
>> Got it, how do you network then,
during COVID?

266
00:15:55,365 --> 00:16:00,440
>> Yeah, so these events are great, right,

267
00:16:00,440 --> 00:16:03,560
I mean, so I always try to look at
the bright side of things, right.

268
00:16:03,560 --> 00:16:05,680
A lot of events now have gone online,
right.

269
00:16:05,680 --> 00:16:08,740
Before, you would have to travel
to these events and book a hotel,

270
00:16:08,740 --> 00:16:12,080
book a flight,
plus the cost of the event itself.

271
00:16:12,080 --> 00:16:14,780
Now with COVID,
I think all of them have gone online.

272
00:16:16,170 --> 00:16:20,790
So it's a great opportunity to
kind of join a lot of these

273
00:16:20,790 --> 00:16:25,150
chats, there's a lot of Slack channels,
open.

274
00:16:25,150 --> 00:16:31,060
And try to participate, try to put as
much information out there as you can.

275
00:16:31,060 --> 00:16:33,000
One of the good things about
the development community,

276
00:16:33,000 --> 00:16:37,470
is that it's very open and
that it's always looking for help,

277
00:16:37,470 --> 00:16:39,000
it's always looking for
a lot of people to contribute.

278
00:16:40,508 --> 00:16:45,240
So, contribute, and it can be small
things, it can be very small things,

279
00:16:45,240 --> 00:16:48,280
but just trying to put yourself
out there as much as possible.

280
00:16:48,280 --> 00:16:51,600
>> Got it, so
find something you're passionate about and

281
00:16:51,600 --> 00:16:56,675
try to contribute to it,
a project or a movement or anything.

282
00:16:56,675 --> 00:17:01,360
>> Yeah, and one last thing is, so
again, going back to that experience.

283
00:17:01,360 --> 00:17:06,440
Which it's always hard to get that
first job, once you get that first job.

284
00:17:06,440 --> 00:17:07,662
There's a lot of friends right now,

285
00:17:07,662 --> 00:17:10,310
I have a couple of friends
who had a restaurant, right.

286
00:17:10,310 --> 00:17:11,420
With everything going on,
they had to close,

287
00:17:11,420 --> 00:17:13,370
they didn't have any presence online.

288
00:17:13,370 --> 00:17:14,630
So there were psyched for,

289
00:17:14,630 --> 00:17:17,980
we had a couple of students from
the bootcamp do a couple of their sites.

290
00:17:17,980 --> 00:17:21,500
Very simple just a menu online that
looks presentable, but that's a lot for

291
00:17:21,500 --> 00:17:26,250
them, because from nothing to that,
that is a huge step forward.

292
00:17:26,250 --> 00:17:29,560
So that right there you have an actual
product that you can actually show.

293
00:17:29,560 --> 00:17:30,600
>> Right.
>> So trying to get

294
00:17:30,600 --> 00:17:32,790
as much experience as you can
under the wings is gonna make you.

295
00:17:34,040 --> 00:17:35,470
>> Gonna make you successful.

296
00:17:35,470 --> 00:17:43,985
So how long do people need to mentally
prepare to go through this job search?

297
00:17:43,985 --> 00:17:48,040
Help set expectations here, so

298
00:17:48,040 --> 00:17:51,635
people don't quit too early.

299
00:17:51,635 --> 00:17:56,260
>> [COUGH] So first thing is, well,
all right, let's go preCOVID, cuz I had

300
00:17:56,260 --> 00:18:01,552
a couple good numbers preCOVID, I'm still
in code during this whole pandemic.

301
00:18:01,552 --> 00:18:07,990
So preCOVID, I said you can't expect,
anything below 90 days is usually scammy,

302
00:18:07,990 --> 00:18:12,080
not real interviews, or really bad things
that they'll just pick anybody up and

303
00:18:12,080 --> 00:18:13,380
pay them at a really low wage.

304
00:18:13,380 --> 00:18:15,107
I mean, I've seen that,
I've gone through that.

305
00:18:15,107 --> 00:18:18,607
So anything below 90
days doesn't seem real.

306
00:18:18,607 --> 00:18:22,685
You'll start getting a couple,
if you follow the process, apply and

307
00:18:22,685 --> 00:18:25,458
go through this whole
process of application.

308
00:18:25,458 --> 00:18:28,640
I think you'll start seeing some
results after about 90 days.

309
00:18:28,640 --> 00:18:31,810
Now it also does depend sometimes,
timing right.

310
00:18:31,810 --> 00:18:34,878
December is a very dead month,
so we're already October, so

311
00:18:34,878 --> 00:18:40,390
if we're thinking 90 days from now,
we're looking to be in end of December.

312
00:18:40,390 --> 00:18:43,183
That's a dead month, right, the end of
December, the first couple of weeks of

313
00:18:43,183 --> 00:18:45,490
January, is a dead month, so
you gotta account for that as well.

314
00:18:48,360 --> 00:18:52,660
>> After you've completed
your tech degree or bootcamp,

315
00:18:52,660 --> 00:18:58,115
full time, 90 days of applying for jobs,
or is this just a couple hours a day?

316
00:18:58,115 --> 00:19:02,655
Help set expectations about the amount
of work during that 90 days.

317
00:19:02,655 --> 00:19:07,359
>> Well, so looking for
a job is a job, right.

318
00:19:07,359 --> 00:19:10,060
>> That's a good way to put it.

319
00:19:10,060 --> 00:19:13,110
>> I mean, because that's what you want,
right, is you want a job out of it.

320
00:19:13,110 --> 00:19:16,388
It's gonna take effort because you're
probably working on your portfolio, you're

321
00:19:16,388 --> 00:19:19,760
probably working on your resume, you're
probably working on crafting emails.

322
00:19:20,870 --> 00:19:23,670
I personally am not a big fan of cover
letters, they work for some people.

323
00:19:23,670 --> 00:19:26,895
For me if it's never worked, maybe I'm
just not good at writing cover letters.

324
00:19:26,895 --> 00:19:32,358
But making a good email has worked for
me, networking has worked for me.

325
00:19:32,358 --> 00:19:36,460
And these things that we talked
about have worked for me.

326
00:19:36,460 --> 00:19:39,175
So I would set yourself, again, time.

327
00:19:39,175 --> 00:19:41,740
Again, I'm really big in trying to
schedule, so I would schedule myself

328
00:19:41,740 --> 00:19:44,695
a good chunk of your day if
your objective is to get a job.

329
00:19:44,695 --> 00:19:49,440
Set yourself a nine to five, literally,
like I said, getting a job is a job, so

330
00:19:49,440 --> 00:19:51,107
set yourself a nine to five.

331
00:19:51,107 --> 00:19:54,470
And in that time you try
to push the truck forward,

332
00:19:54,470 --> 00:19:57,290
try to push everything
forward to get that job.

333
00:19:57,290 --> 00:20:00,550
>> I love it, gosh, that's great advice.

334
00:20:00,550 --> 00:20:04,020
So I've got a couple more
questions to get through, and

335
00:20:04,020 --> 00:20:06,420
then we're already getting
some great questions.

336
00:20:06,420 --> 00:20:09,400
Just so you know, the audience,
we are monitoring your questions,

337
00:20:09,400 --> 00:20:13,810
and I'll be asking Will
those in about 20 minutes.

338
00:20:13,810 --> 00:20:18,670
So keep those questions coming, and
my team will write those down and

339
00:20:18,670 --> 00:20:20,100
send them to me.

340
00:20:20,100 --> 00:20:25,440
All right, so,
next question I have for you is,

341
00:20:25,440 --> 00:20:30,860
you have a lot of experience among various
companies as an engineer or instructor.

342
00:20:30,860 --> 00:20:33,190
Have you leveraged networking
to land these roles?

343
00:20:33,190 --> 00:20:39,850
You talked about networking, but
what specific tips can you give?

344
00:20:39,850 --> 00:20:43,860
So you're at an online conference,
great, what do you do,

345
00:20:43,860 --> 00:20:45,838
how do you actually network?

346
00:20:45,838 --> 00:20:49,087
>> Yeah, so it depends on the events,
so, there's been a movement,

347
00:20:49,087 --> 00:20:50,859
right now all events are doing this.

348
00:20:50,859 --> 00:20:55,101
But I think some events have this
kind of speed dating opportunity.

349
00:20:55,101 --> 00:20:57,072
That's really good, cuz it kinda helps,

350
00:20:57,072 --> 00:21:00,970
give the opportunity to at least talk to
somebody for X amount of time, right?

351
00:21:00,970 --> 00:21:05,910
So, I think, the best way of networking
is how do you make yourself available,

352
00:21:05,910 --> 00:21:08,220
and how you make yourself
useful to the other person.

353
00:21:08,220 --> 00:21:10,760
I think that's the rule of networking,
right, it's not so

354
00:21:10,760 --> 00:21:13,530
much what you could get out, but
it's usually what you can give.

355
00:21:13,530 --> 00:21:15,670
And in that process of giving,
you end up meeting, like I said, right?

356
00:21:15,670 --> 00:21:17,285
Somebody or
you made a small restaurant, or

357
00:21:17,285 --> 00:21:20,399
an owner of a small restaurant that needs
somebody help them out with their website.

358
00:21:20,399 --> 00:21:26,984
And the fact that you can give,
may lead to a referral and more more jobs.

359
00:21:26,984 --> 00:21:29,850
So, I would approach any
networking opportunity as,

360
00:21:29,850 --> 00:21:33,911
what can I give to the person that I'm
talking to, what is that person doing?

361
00:21:33,911 --> 00:21:38,223
How can I help in that whatever field
they're doing, and that just helps.

362
00:21:38,223 --> 00:21:42,486
So just going with that mindset and,
because we go with the mindset of,

363
00:21:42,486 --> 00:21:45,769
what am I gonna get, right,
is it normal, is it okay?

364
00:21:45,769 --> 00:21:47,114
But we tend to go with that mindset, so

365
00:21:47,114 --> 00:21:48,719
switching our mindset
can take us a long way.

366
00:21:48,719 --> 00:21:55,038
>> Got it, so can you give [LAUGH]
anybody some specific tactics?

367
00:21:55,038 --> 00:21:58,047
So, say you're in one of these
speed dating scenarios, and

368
00:21:58,047 --> 00:22:00,820
everybody here is gonna have
an opportunity to do this.

369
00:22:00,820 --> 00:22:03,974
So hopping allows networking
where you get these,

370
00:22:03,974 --> 00:22:08,680
I think the three minute networking
sessions, whether it's a video call.

371
00:22:10,180 --> 00:22:12,720
Give folks some kinda opening lines, or

372
00:22:12,720 --> 00:22:16,890
some ways that they can make those
networking sessions more successful?

373
00:22:20,030 --> 00:22:26,185
>> So, craft out a 30 second
elevator pitch of yourself, right?

374
00:22:26,185 --> 00:22:29,645
So, in 30 seconds and then,
close it at 30 seconds, like I said,

375
00:22:29,645 --> 00:22:30,829
this is three minutes.

376
00:22:30,829 --> 00:22:35,522
So, 30 seconds gives you enough time
to present yourself, say where you are,

377
00:22:35,522 --> 00:22:38,780
what you do,
what you're looking for, 30 seconds.

378
00:22:41,150 --> 00:22:44,310
Try to, especially these events,
if you can have again, a Bitly,

379
00:22:44,310 --> 00:22:46,710
or any way of you know sharing
your information quickly.

380
00:22:46,710 --> 00:22:50,200
I know that people say, yeah, add me on
LinkedIn, but that sometimes works, but

381
00:22:50,200 --> 00:22:51,021
tends to get lost.

382
00:22:51,021 --> 00:22:53,270
So, keeping your things
as smart as possible,

383
00:22:53,270 --> 00:22:55,757
if you can find yourself
a URL that's really smart.

384
00:22:55,757 --> 00:23:00,521
And you could share with the other person,
will@x.com, boom, you probably know that.

385
00:23:00,521 --> 00:23:05,861
You can probably write that down,
and we can keep talking

386
00:23:05,861 --> 00:23:10,765
if the conversation is positive to listen,
right?

387
00:23:10,765 --> 00:23:14,457
So, ask questions that you wanna
listen to the other person,

388
00:23:14,457 --> 00:23:16,235
give the other persons also.

389
00:23:16,235 --> 00:23:19,791
And I know that some people
tend to be shy, right,

390
00:23:19,791 --> 00:23:23,190
I'm also shy sometimes
in networking events.

391
00:23:23,190 --> 00:23:27,227
So just trying to tell me
a little bit about yourself,

392
00:23:27,227 --> 00:23:30,289
and actually listening is pretty good.

393
00:23:30,289 --> 00:23:34,963
>> I love that, those are great tips,
Will, pointed out something I think that's

394
00:23:34,963 --> 00:23:39,310
important, a lot of us are introverts or
feel intimidated by networking.

395
00:23:39,310 --> 00:23:45,150
I'm actually an introvert, the thought
of a room of people that I don't know,

396
00:23:45,150 --> 00:23:47,260
terrifies me.

397
00:23:47,260 --> 00:23:52,770
And the secret is that, actually good
networkers don't do most of the talking,

398
00:23:52,770 --> 00:23:55,293
right, so it's mostly listening.

399
00:23:55,293 --> 00:23:59,967
So, if everyone listening,
you can do something really simple,

400
00:23:59,967 --> 00:24:01,808
like start with Will's.

401
00:24:01,808 --> 00:24:04,704
Super fast, 30 second, hey,
just a little bit about me.

402
00:24:04,704 --> 00:24:08,469
And then immediately, you can launch into,
what's something that you're really

403
00:24:08,469 --> 00:24:11,717
passionate about right now, or
you're really excited about, right?

404
00:24:11,717 --> 00:24:16,295
Just kinda let that person, and
it could be, garbage collection, right,

405
00:24:16,295 --> 00:24:18,019
it doesn't really matter.

406
00:24:18,019 --> 00:24:22,854
But then you just say, wow,
garbage collection, tell me more, right?

407
00:24:22,854 --> 00:24:27,495
So you'll just get the other person
talking, and that'll be a successful

408
00:24:27,495 --> 00:24:31,931
conversation, and they'll wanna
keep connecting with you, right?

409
00:24:31,931 --> 00:24:36,534
So I would encourage everybody to not view

410
00:24:36,534 --> 00:24:41,401
that initial networking
chat as you needing

411
00:24:41,401 --> 00:24:46,014
to get them to offer you a job or
anything.

412
00:24:46,014 --> 00:24:50,162
You're basically selling another meeting,
right, another chat, like hey,

413
00:24:50,162 --> 00:24:52,660
do you mind if I email you some time?

414
00:24:52,660 --> 00:24:55,160
Sure, yeah, okay, what's your email?

415
00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:59,248
So you kind of approach it as,
just getting them to kinda smile and

416
00:24:59,248 --> 00:25:02,490
like you at step one, and
then after that you can go further.

417
00:25:02,490 --> 00:25:06,550
So, I'm actually gonna post,
there's something called mirroring,

418
00:25:06,550 --> 00:25:10,100
and I've talked about this a lot,
mirroring is a very effective way.

419
00:25:10,100 --> 00:25:13,242
To increase someone's liking of you, and

420
00:25:13,242 --> 00:25:19,189
the effectiveness of that conversation,
and it sounds creepy, but it's not.

421
00:25:19,189 --> 00:25:21,216
It's just kind of-
>> [LAUGH]

422
00:25:21,216 --> 00:25:23,319
>> Fun to put that in the chat.

423
00:25:23,319 --> 00:25:27,143
Okay, so got some more questions for you.

424
00:25:27,143 --> 00:25:35,220
All right, We talked about
formatting the resume a little bit.

425
00:25:35,220 --> 00:25:39,110
Why don't you share a little bit more
specifics on, what are the sections you

426
00:25:39,110 --> 00:25:43,580
think are important in that resume for
first time developers?

427
00:25:45,700 --> 00:25:50,637
>> So, I think the first part of your
resume is your contact information,

428
00:25:50,637 --> 00:25:52,377
do not put your picture.

429
00:25:52,377 --> 00:25:54,981
In South America it's really common for
people to put their picture,

430
00:25:54,981 --> 00:25:55,652
I do not know why.

431
00:25:55,652 --> 00:26:00,426
But [LAUGH] just put your own contact
information, don't put where you're from,

432
00:26:00,426 --> 00:26:03,208
specifically now that
a lot of jobs are remote.

433
00:26:03,208 --> 00:26:06,620
If they need to know they'll ask you, I
think just your basic contact information.

434
00:26:06,620 --> 00:26:08,658
Your portfolio link at the top,

435
00:26:08,658 --> 00:26:11,990
really easy to get to small
summary about yourself.

436
00:26:12,990 --> 00:26:16,340
Small summary is what we're looking for,
I guess one or two sentence.

437
00:26:16,340 --> 00:26:19,110
I do like a section for skills.

438
00:26:19,110 --> 00:26:20,893
>> Okay.

439
00:26:20,893 --> 00:26:25,717
>> Usually, I tend to have it at the top,
again, so you can really quickly see.

440
00:26:25,717 --> 00:26:28,608
Because, either I would
load it up with the skills,

441
00:26:28,608 --> 00:26:31,117
that again we talked about earlier, right?

442
00:26:31,117 --> 00:26:33,559
If it's trying to load them or highlight
them or figure out a way to kinda show

443
00:26:33,559 --> 00:26:35,599
them a little bit brighter the skills
that have to do with that.

444
00:26:35,599 --> 00:26:38,424
React, if you're talking about job Node,
TypeScript, right,

445
00:26:38,424 --> 00:26:41,794
you've got to be more specific
>> Is it a list of skills or,

446
00:26:41,794 --> 00:26:44,345
be more specific around that?

447
00:26:44,345 --> 00:26:48,323
>> I'll do bullet points about them,
all right?

448
00:26:48,323 --> 00:26:49,275
>> Okay.

449
00:26:49,275 --> 00:26:53,282
>> Wow, so, and again, if I'm trying
to just apply to one of these systems

450
00:26:53,282 --> 00:26:55,069
that I'm just doing it online.

451
00:26:55,069 --> 00:26:57,811
I'll try to load a couple
more keywords in there,

452
00:26:57,811 --> 00:27:01,024
that's probably the section
that I'm gonna try to load.

453
00:27:01,024 --> 00:27:03,507
>> Okay.
>> Then I would do, your work experience,

454
00:27:03,507 --> 00:27:07,974
if you have work experience, if you don't
have work experience your projects.

455
00:27:07,974 --> 00:27:08,521
>> Okay.

456
00:27:08,521 --> 00:27:09,174
>> Right?

457
00:27:09,174 --> 00:27:12,672
And then your project, and then a little
description of what your project is,

458
00:27:12,672 --> 00:27:14,135
what it does, keeping it very.

459
00:27:14,135 --> 00:27:16,200
I like to keep resumes to one page,

460
00:27:16,200 --> 00:27:19,200
I'm gonna try to keep
everything very simple there.

461
00:27:19,200 --> 00:27:23,535
And then, in your projects,
if they're hosted the link,

462
00:27:23,535 --> 00:27:26,062
also the technology that you use.

463
00:27:26,062 --> 00:27:31,277
So if you did a project with jQuery and
some CSS and some framework.

464
00:27:31,277 --> 00:27:33,876
Put all that information there, again,

465
00:27:33,876 --> 00:27:37,598
you wanna load it with as much
technical details as you can.

466
00:27:37,598 --> 00:27:38,694
>> Okay.
>> And

467
00:27:38,694 --> 00:27:41,318
then so-
>> And you can choose at least two to

468
00:27:41,318 --> 00:27:43,361
three good projects, right,
that are finished and polished?

469
00:27:43,361 --> 00:27:45,043
>> Yeah, finished.

470
00:27:45,043 --> 00:27:45,946
>> Okay.
>> And then the key

471
00:27:45,946 --> 00:27:47,085
word there would be finished.

472
00:27:47,085 --> 00:27:50,216
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah, and polished ideally,-

473
00:27:50,216 --> 00:27:50,865
>> Okay.

474
00:27:50,865 --> 00:27:52,184
>> Just looking decent.

475
00:27:52,184 --> 00:27:52,848
>> Okay.

476
00:27:52,848 --> 00:27:57,643
>> And then at the end,
any additional information that you think.

477
00:27:57,643 --> 00:28:01,530
Maybe something fun to talk about,
at the talking point, like a hobby or

478
00:28:01,530 --> 00:28:02,753
something like that.

479
00:28:02,753 --> 00:28:06,041
Usually, I add that to the resumes
that I'm gonna hand or send to people.

480
00:28:06,041 --> 00:28:08,915
So that when they see it,
that sometimes opens a talking point,

481
00:28:08,915 --> 00:28:09,936
it can be like soccer.

482
00:28:09,936 --> 00:28:12,491
And you can kinda have an easier
conversation from there with

483
00:28:12,491 --> 00:28:13,201
the interview.

484
00:28:13,201 --> 00:28:17,095
>> Got it, okay, perfect,
and one page, right?

485
00:28:17,095 --> 00:28:18,784
>> I keep it at one page, yeah.

486
00:28:18,784 --> 00:28:24,898
>> One page, and PDF, Google Doc,
one page, what is it?

487
00:28:24,898 --> 00:28:31,297
>> So, I think keep it in PDF format, it's
just easier to share, doesn't move around.

488
00:28:31,297 --> 00:28:34,214
I think at this point
everybody has a PDF reader,

489
00:28:34,214 --> 00:28:34,764
so-
>> Yeah.

490
00:28:34,764 --> 00:28:37,218
>> And I think PDF is also smaller
when you share it as well.

491
00:28:37,218 --> 00:28:39,479
>> Got it, so Will mentioned something,

492
00:28:39,479 --> 00:28:43,945
and everyone that's attending I want
you to hear this, that is a great idea.

493
00:28:43,945 --> 00:28:50,806
He talked about, doing a website for
a local restaurant or something like that.

494
00:28:50,806 --> 00:28:55,174
We talked about this in our
trails festival session, and

495
00:28:55,174 --> 00:28:57,997
my team, can you link to that video?

496
00:28:57,997 --> 00:29:01,086
Where we specifically talked
about job search tactics, so

497
00:29:01,086 --> 00:29:03,506
all the students can go
watch that after this.

498
00:29:03,506 --> 00:29:08,932
But, what we talked about is,
essentially creating your experience.

499
00:29:08,932 --> 00:29:13,100
And the way to do that is,
Will, what you said,

500
00:29:13,100 --> 00:29:16,437
you basically find an organization or

501
00:29:16,437 --> 00:29:21,140
a small business in your area,
that needs a website.

502
00:29:21,140 --> 00:29:26,830
And you go to them and say, hey,
I'm getting into the industry,

503
00:29:26,830 --> 00:29:31,500
can I build you that site for
free, at first, right?

504
00:29:31,500 --> 00:29:35,690
I'm just building my experience, and
most people say yes, and then you do that.

505
00:29:35,690 --> 00:29:38,650
And then you've got a real live project,
right?

506
00:29:39,660 --> 00:29:42,840
And then, what you can do is find
something you're passionate about,

507
00:29:42,840 --> 00:29:47,152
like a church, a synagogue,
a mosque, or a movement.

508
00:29:47,152 --> 00:29:52,220
A nonprofit, anything you're passionate
about, they probably need help,

509
00:29:52,220 --> 00:29:54,080
they probably need a better website.

510
00:29:54,080 --> 00:29:57,760
Go to them, and say, hey, how can I help?

511
00:29:57,760 --> 00:30:01,040
And then that second project, could be
something you're truly passionate about,

512
00:30:01,040 --> 00:30:05,820
which shows Proactivity,
it shows integrity,

513
00:30:05,820 --> 00:30:08,520
it shows all those other traits
that employers gonna look for.

514
00:30:08,520 --> 00:30:12,465
So you could say I built the site for
this nonprofit I'm passionate about,

515
00:30:12,465 --> 00:30:19,480
the skills I used to do that,
it kind of goes that next level.

516
00:30:19,480 --> 00:30:23,040
And it essentially hides your
lack of paid experience, right?

517
00:30:23,040 --> 00:30:26,110
We're trying to show
you're doing real things,

518
00:30:26,110 --> 00:30:31,000
like Will said, doing is what matters,
but you don't have to have that.

519
00:30:31,000 --> 00:30:33,760
You don't have to have that,
I've been paid for

520
00:30:33,760 --> 00:30:38,040
two years as a frontend developer
experience, you can do that without that.

521
00:30:38,040 --> 00:30:39,830
So I just want to kinda
drop that in there.

522
00:30:41,180 --> 00:30:43,470
Do you wanna kinda build on it that,

523
00:30:43,470 --> 00:30:46,320
Will, or-
>> Yeah, yeah, so I'll give you a couple

524
00:30:46,320 --> 00:30:49,460
of examples when the Muslim ban
happened a couple years ago.

525
00:30:49,460 --> 00:30:53,870
I remember a couple of my students went to
JFK, they made a very simple site, jQuery,

526
00:30:53,870 --> 00:30:54,555
very basic.

527
00:30:54,555 --> 00:30:58,520
And all it was doing is allowing people to
know if somebody, I think, was stopped or

528
00:30:58,520 --> 00:31:00,800
not in the airport, couldn't get out.

529
00:31:00,800 --> 00:31:03,850
And then pretty much a simple list,
very simple,

530
00:31:03,850 --> 00:31:08,080
but again, it's that idea of proactivity.

531
00:31:08,080 --> 00:31:13,170
Take a second also, it's good to
do the reverse experience, right?

532
00:31:13,170 --> 00:31:15,630
So you look at it from the developer
point of view, I'm looking for a job.

533
00:31:15,630 --> 00:31:17,450
Take a minute also and
go to the business perspective and

534
00:31:17,450 --> 00:31:18,990
look at it from the business side.

535
00:31:18,990 --> 00:31:20,130
Who would I wanna hire?

536
00:31:20,130 --> 00:31:22,300
Ask yourself that question
what I wanna hire myself.

537
00:31:22,300 --> 00:31:24,760
What do I need to do or
what does that person needs to do for

538
00:31:24,760 --> 00:31:26,810
that person to become hireable, right?

539
00:31:26,810 --> 00:31:29,113
So not only skills, right,
which you can pick up, and

540
00:31:29,113 --> 00:31:31,030
a lot of places are okay
with you not knowing.

541
00:31:31,030 --> 00:31:33,918
Because most likely you're gonna
have to pick up some new technology.

542
00:31:33,918 --> 00:31:36,220
So they wanna see that you have
the capability of picking things up.

543
00:31:36,220 --> 00:31:39,360
So if you have two or three projects
with different things on them or

544
00:31:39,360 --> 00:31:42,840
using different libraries, shows you
that capability of picking things up.

545
00:31:42,840 --> 00:31:46,741
But also, I'd rather have a person
that's like you said, proactive, right?

546
00:31:46,741 --> 00:31:49,603
Now we'll go ahead and try to,
I don't have the experience for, hey,

547
00:31:49,603 --> 00:31:51,815
look, I did a website for
XYZ, I did this, I did that.

548
00:31:51,815 --> 00:31:55,350
That person shows that they
wanna keep moving forward.

549
00:31:55,350 --> 00:31:58,766
And sometimes when you kind of
have a toss up between two people,

550
00:31:58,766 --> 00:32:02,321
I would rather always take somebody
that shows this proactivity.

551
00:32:02,321 --> 00:32:02,980
>> Absoluely.
>> So yeah.

552
00:32:02,980 --> 00:32:04,512
>> Absolutely, okay, great.

553
00:32:04,512 --> 00:32:09,250
We're gonna get to questions
in about eight minutes, so

554
00:32:09,250 --> 00:32:12,435
let's go jump to the first
actual interview, right?

555
00:32:12,435 --> 00:32:17,910
So we've said, okay, you finish
your curriculum, build your two,

556
00:32:17,910 --> 00:32:23,050
three real projects, make sure that
they look good and they're finished.

557
00:32:23,050 --> 00:32:27,320
Get your resume built out and
start applying and

558
00:32:27,320 --> 00:32:29,880
treat it as a job,
it's gonna be hard work for 90 days.

559
00:32:29,880 --> 00:32:32,840
Okay, so they've done that,
they finally got their first interview.

560
00:32:33,880 --> 00:32:37,650
Give us some tips for
that first interview, which is terrifying.

561
00:32:39,020 --> 00:32:39,550
>> Yeah, so

562
00:32:39,550 --> 00:32:43,570
the first, all right, so I'd like to talk
to people, how people approach things.

563
00:32:43,570 --> 00:32:44,840
So, first thing that you're gonna fail.

564
00:32:46,470 --> 00:32:50,321
And sounds completely counterintuitive,
but think that you're going to fail,

565
00:32:50,321 --> 00:32:53,580
because the first couple of
interviews you are nervous, right?

566
00:32:53,580 --> 00:32:56,025
I don't think there's anything I can
say to stop you from being nervous,

567
00:32:56,025 --> 00:32:56,900
cuz it's your first interview.

568
00:32:56,900 --> 00:32:59,388
You don't know what you're getting into,
right, so

569
00:32:59,388 --> 00:33:02,150
you don't know what
you're gonna get asked.

570
00:33:02,150 --> 00:33:05,280
So you just have that nervousness,
and I'm not gonna lie to you and

571
00:33:05,280 --> 00:33:07,860
be like, I'm gonna tell you something
that's magically gonna go away.

572
00:33:07,860 --> 00:33:11,870
No, you're not, you're mostly gonna
still be nervous on that first spot.

573
00:33:11,870 --> 00:33:15,007
So think that you're gonna fail because
it makes it all easier when you think,

574
00:33:15,007 --> 00:33:17,097
all right,
I'm not gonna pass this interview, but

575
00:33:17,097 --> 00:33:19,782
I'm gonna use this interview as
a learning opportunity, right?

576
00:33:19,782 --> 00:33:22,795
So, I mean,
a lot of my students specifically,

577
00:33:22,795 --> 00:33:28,020
I know the first two or three interviews,
it's not gonna go that well for them.

578
00:33:28,020 --> 00:33:31,300
So if they approach it with another idea
with the idea of I'm gonna learn from

579
00:33:31,300 --> 00:33:35,470
this, any question I can't answer,
I'm gonna write it down.

580
00:33:35,470 --> 00:33:39,520
I'm gonna go back and research it,
I'm gonna try different things.

581
00:33:39,520 --> 00:33:40,240
And actually,

582
00:33:40,240 --> 00:33:44,740
it's been better, it's been given better
results now than the other way around.

583
00:33:44,740 --> 00:33:46,720
So the first thing is you kinda
wanna go with that mentality.

584
00:33:48,420 --> 00:33:52,930
During the interview itself,
asking questions is really important.

585
00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:59,570
I know this comes from a place that,
you have a job so it's easier to say this,

586
00:33:59,570 --> 00:34:01,280
but you are gonna work there.

587
00:34:01,280 --> 00:34:05,450
So you do wanna ask questions because the
worst thing that can happen is you end up

588
00:34:05,450 --> 00:34:08,760
working for a company,
you're there for three months.

589
00:34:08,760 --> 00:34:10,310
You don't like it, you have a bad boss or

590
00:34:10,310 --> 00:34:13,090
the company doesn't
meet your expectations.

591
00:34:13,090 --> 00:34:14,940
So then you're gonna go back into the job.

592
00:34:14,940 --> 00:34:19,292
So you really put 90 days of work, you
don't really wanna throw it away, right?

593
00:34:19,292 --> 00:34:22,601
And so they're interviewing you, yes, but

594
00:34:22,601 --> 00:34:26,330
you're also kind of
interviewing them as well.

595
00:34:26,330 --> 00:34:32,050
So asking questions,
where have you guys kept your developers,

596
00:34:32,050 --> 00:34:35,830
your developers still working here or
does everybody leave in three months?

597
00:34:35,830 --> 00:34:37,700
Well, that's probably a red flag, right?

598
00:34:39,870 --> 00:34:45,019
What's your process for junior developers,
you guys pair them with a senior developer

599
00:34:45,019 --> 00:34:49,767
or some type of mentoring program so they
can kind of learn and pick up new skills?

600
00:34:49,767 --> 00:34:53,270
Things like that where you wanna ask
questions cuz you wanna keep growing as

601
00:34:53,270 --> 00:34:54,730
a development, all right?

602
00:34:54,730 --> 00:34:57,330
That first job, I've

603
00:34:57,330 --> 00:35:02,150
had a lot of students that had a first
remote job before COVID, right?

604
00:35:02,150 --> 00:35:04,868
This was a little bit before COVID so
remote wasn't, and they've worked,

605
00:35:04,868 --> 00:35:07,150
they've improved a lot in remote work.

606
00:35:07,150 --> 00:35:09,047
But they had a really bad experiences, so

607
00:35:09,047 --> 00:35:12,050
bad experiences that they think
the development is not for me and

608
00:35:12,050 --> 00:35:13,980
they probably completely went
back to whatever they were doing.

609
00:35:13,980 --> 00:35:15,840
And that has to do a lot
with their first job.

610
00:35:16,886 --> 00:35:20,677
So, asking questions.

611
00:35:20,677 --> 00:35:24,031
The first couple of ones, try to learn
from your first couple of interviews as

612
00:35:24,031 --> 00:35:25,405
much as you can
>> Okay,

613
00:35:25,405 --> 00:35:29,750
what are they gonna ask you technically?

614
00:35:29,750 --> 00:35:32,680
I mean,
what do you imagine the scariest part is?

615
00:35:32,680 --> 00:35:36,906
Are they gonna ask me to code live or they
gonna ask me to do some whiteboarding,

616
00:35:36,906 --> 00:35:38,970
what should people be preparing for?

617
00:35:40,210 --> 00:35:43,380
>> So it depends kind of what
type of company you apply to.

618
00:35:43,380 --> 00:35:47,660
I think if you're going to like the big or
your Facebook's and all that,

619
00:35:47,660 --> 00:35:49,780
those tend to be heavy on whiteboarding.

620
00:35:49,780 --> 00:35:52,140
If you're going to a medium-sized company,

621
00:35:52,140 --> 00:35:55,240
those tend to be more towards
assigning you projects.

622
00:35:55,240 --> 00:35:58,920
Here, pick a and React from scratch.

623
00:35:58,920 --> 00:36:03,250
And if you go to smaller companies,
startups, they just tend to be more kind

624
00:36:03,250 --> 00:36:06,160
of interview process question,
maybe technical questions.

625
00:36:08,620 --> 00:36:12,107
They range from really
complicated to very simple, but

626
00:36:12,107 --> 00:36:16,122
the more classic ones are usually
applying to a React position.

627
00:36:16,122 --> 00:36:19,949
What is the virtual DOM,
for example, what's an API,

628
00:36:19,949 --> 00:36:22,820
what are the lifecycle methods, right?

629
00:36:22,820 --> 00:36:24,769
Usually when you are applying for
like a React position,

630
00:36:24,769 --> 00:36:26,730
these are the more common
questions that you'll see me.

631
00:36:26,730 --> 00:36:29,997
>> Okay.

632
00:36:29,997 --> 00:36:34,565
>> How can you make or
can you write a simple button click,

633
00:36:34,565 --> 00:36:39,250
can you do a simple button
click with using React hooks?

634
00:36:40,610 --> 00:36:43,176
Because those are very
simple 30-minute questions.

635
00:36:43,176 --> 00:36:47,690
>> Got it, is it appropriate to ask for
the agenda of the interview?

636
00:36:47,690 --> 00:36:49,040
What are we gonna cover?

637
00:36:49,040 --> 00:36:50,790
>> Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,

638
00:36:50,790 --> 00:36:54,340
I think that's again, yeah,
that's a really good point, yeah.

639
00:36:54,340 --> 00:36:57,210
What's gonna be the process, what are we
gonna cover, who am I gonna talk to?

640
00:36:57,210 --> 00:36:58,950
That's also good,
ask who you're gonna talk to,

641
00:36:58,950 --> 00:37:01,680
because then you can go turn around and
do a quick research on that person.

642
00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:05,475
And see, yeah, is this guy more of the HR,
is this guy more of the developer,

643
00:37:05,475 --> 00:37:07,165
more like what is he more leaning?

644
00:37:07,165 --> 00:37:08,612
>> Right.
>> So then you can kind of also prepare

645
00:37:08,612 --> 00:37:10,055
a couple talking points-
>> Right.

646
00:37:10,055 --> 00:37:10,605
>> Then you speak.

647
00:37:10,605 --> 00:37:15,940
>> And then next level is you connect to
him on LinkedIn and say, hey, I'm really

648
00:37:15,940 --> 00:37:20,150
excited to meet you in the interview
coming up, would love to connect here.

649
00:37:20,150 --> 00:37:22,460
And they're gonna go, whoa,
this person's proactive,

650
00:37:22,460 --> 00:37:27,080
their emotional intelligence
a little higher.

651
00:37:27,080 --> 00:37:31,860
Whatever you can do to affect that
potential outcome would be great.

652
00:37:33,640 --> 00:37:37,780
So all right, great, so
we talked about the real interview.

653
00:37:37,780 --> 00:37:40,450
Some real life is going on right here,
my dog just came in.

654
00:37:40,450 --> 00:37:41,970
Hey Jackson, can you please?

655
00:37:43,790 --> 00:37:45,160
She will bark.

656
00:37:45,160 --> 00:37:46,890
And can you close the door, please?

657
00:37:46,890 --> 00:37:51,083
Thank you.
It's my 12-year old, everybody.

658
00:37:51,083 --> 00:37:52,501
>> [LAUGH]
>> COVID, here we go.

659
00:37:52,501 --> 00:37:56,650
Okay, so thank you so much for
covering this process.

660
00:37:56,650 --> 00:38:00,970
So before we take questions in
two minutes, can you reiterate,

661
00:38:00,970 --> 00:38:05,377
at a high level, the playbook
that we've been discussing here.

662
00:38:05,377 --> 00:38:09,651
From, okay, you've completed your
credential or your coding boot camp,

663
00:38:09,651 --> 00:38:12,410
d walk us through it real quick,
the high level.

664
00:38:13,920 --> 00:38:18,922
>> Yeah, so
you wanna have two resumes, right?

665
00:38:18,922 --> 00:38:23,520
You wanna have at least two projects
finished and looking decent.

666
00:38:23,520 --> 00:38:26,740
You want to have some type of spreadsheet
where you can keep track of all

667
00:38:26,740 --> 00:38:29,100
your interviews and
everywhere you apply to.

668
00:38:29,100 --> 00:38:31,470
I wouldn't talk a lot about that,
but really quickly,

669
00:38:31,470 --> 00:38:33,400
what you wanna do is every application,

670
00:38:33,400 --> 00:38:36,740
you should put it into your Excel
spreadsheet or Google Sheets or whatever.

671
00:38:36,740 --> 00:38:41,110
And keep track of where you are and
what status, that helps out a lot.

672
00:38:41,110 --> 00:38:45,040
Because sometimes,
some jobs won't work out, but

673
00:38:45,040 --> 00:38:47,590
then they'll probably call you back or
they'll tell you,

674
00:38:47,590 --> 00:38:50,740
hey, you're almost there,
come back in maybe six months.

675
00:38:50,740 --> 00:38:54,430
So you wanna log that, so you can come
back three months, six months, whatever.

676
00:38:54,430 --> 00:38:56,805
And come back and apply again with a
little bit more knowledge and experience.

677
00:38:56,805 --> 00:39:01,121
When applying online,
if you're applying on one of these sites,

678
00:39:01,121 --> 00:39:05,976
try to load your resume with as many
keywords applied to places that are your

679
00:39:05,976 --> 00:39:07,918
two years, about two years.

680
00:39:07,918 --> 00:39:12,578
Or any any job description has
a requirement of two years or

681
00:39:12,578 --> 00:39:17,443
less, that's a great opportunity for
a junior developer.

682
00:39:19,470 --> 00:39:23,340
Cold emailing is, in my opinion,
not bad as long as you do it, again,

683
00:39:23,340 --> 00:39:26,850
professionally, keep a good email,
share your projects.

684
00:39:26,850 --> 00:39:30,090
So reaching out always shows proactivity,
the worse case scenario is

685
00:39:30,090 --> 00:39:34,740
that they don't answer back, okay,
that's the end of the story there.

686
00:39:34,740 --> 00:39:36,608
But the places that do answer back,

687
00:39:36,608 --> 00:39:40,670
you have a higher chance of being able
to find that job, so it's a great shot.

688
00:39:43,090 --> 00:39:44,710
And then yeah,
then you have your interview process.

689
00:39:44,710 --> 00:39:46,710
The first couple of ones
are gonna be hard ones, so

690
00:39:46,710 --> 00:39:48,790
try to take them as
learning opportunities.

691
00:39:48,790 --> 00:39:52,480
So give it your best, but try to keep
that in the back of your head that if

692
00:39:52,480 --> 00:39:55,740
you don't get the job in the first
couple of months, that's okay.

693
00:39:55,740 --> 00:40:00,010
It does happen, but
use it as opportunities of learning.

694
00:40:00,010 --> 00:40:02,295
Ask questions, try to find out the agenda.

695
00:40:02,295 --> 00:40:04,817
[COUGH]
>> Great.

696
00:40:04,817 --> 00:40:05,631
>> And it's always good.

697
00:40:05,631 --> 00:40:09,185
Like to get to the end,
always send a thank you email.

698
00:40:09,185 --> 00:40:12,247
Thanks for your time, it was pretty good.

699
00:40:12,247 --> 00:40:16,705
Yeah, sometimes that again puts
you in the back of their heads.

700
00:40:16,705 --> 00:40:18,916
If that interview that they
decided does not work out,

701
00:40:18,916 --> 00:40:20,516
because a candidate can also back out.

702
00:40:20,516 --> 00:40:21,228
>> Yeah.

703
00:40:21,228 --> 00:40:23,395
>> You could be the second choice and
that's totally fine.

704
00:40:23,395 --> 00:40:27,127
>> Yeah, Gosh, those are great tips,
thanks for sharing them.

705
00:40:27,127 --> 00:40:30,189
[COUGH]
>> [COUGH]

706
00:40:30,189 --> 00:40:31,593
>> The other thing you mentioned was, hey,

707
00:40:31,593 --> 00:40:32,770
this is 90 days of work, right?

708
00:40:32,770 --> 00:40:38,132
It's gonna be a lot of work
to get those interviews.

709
00:40:38,132 --> 00:40:41,767
And is it 90 days to get the job,
or just to get the interviews?

710
00:40:41,767 --> 00:40:45,200
>> To get the interviews.

711
00:40:45,200 --> 00:40:47,874
Then you still got whatever,
they're different processes,

712
00:40:47,874 --> 00:40:49,115
they take different times.

713
00:40:49,115 --> 00:40:52,896
But to start getting, in my opinion,
good interviews is that these 90 days.

714
00:40:52,896 --> 00:40:53,911
>> Okay, got it.

715
00:40:53,911 --> 00:40:55,496
All right,
we got a lot of great questions.

716
00:40:55,496 --> 00:41:00,380
We have probably 10 to 12 questions.

717
00:41:00,380 --> 00:41:05,320
So we've got about 15, 16 minutes left.

718
00:41:05,320 --> 00:41:09,660
So about a minute per answer
is probably about right.

719
00:41:09,660 --> 00:41:12,001
Let's do this, all right, from Alyssa.

720
00:41:12,001 --> 00:41:14,992
They said, do you recommend applying for

721
00:41:14,992 --> 00:41:21,300
junior developer positions after
completing a tech degree or a boot camp?

722
00:41:21,300 --> 00:41:24,758
It seems every place requires years
of experience before one can become

723
00:41:24,758 --> 00:41:25,457
a developer.

724
00:41:28,410 --> 00:41:33,761
>> So definitely finishing those things,
some of them give you a certificate,

725
00:41:33,761 --> 00:41:38,388
which is always good as a referencing
back as a point of knowledge.

726
00:41:38,388 --> 00:41:41,122
Yeah, I would say, yeah,
finish them, it's good.

727
00:41:41,122 --> 00:41:44,368
It shows, again, completion,
right, there we go.

728
00:41:44,368 --> 00:41:46,130
>> Family, it's real.

729
00:41:47,390 --> 00:41:51,890
>> Yeah, so do complete them again, this
idea of finishing things is important.

730
00:41:51,890 --> 00:41:53,099
So you always want to
show that you finished.

731
00:41:53,099 --> 00:41:57,203
And then everything else we talked about.

732
00:41:57,203 --> 00:41:58,010
>> I agree with that.

733
00:41:58,010 --> 00:41:59,320
And Alyssa,

734
00:41:59,320 --> 00:42:02,520
you're not gonna have the skills you
need to apply until you finish, right?

735
00:42:02,520 --> 00:42:06,264
So whatever curriculum or
credential you've chosen is designed

736
00:42:06,264 --> 00:42:08,856
to give you a complete
set of skills to apply.

737
00:42:08,856 --> 00:42:12,040
And the projects are gonna be important.

738
00:42:12,040 --> 00:42:15,195
So yeah, I think Will and
I are both saying, complete it, and

739
00:42:15,195 --> 00:42:16,907
then do that 90 day job search.

740
00:42:16,907 --> 00:42:21,705
From Leann, for your resume,
do you recommend putting in all of your

741
00:42:21,705 --> 00:42:26,960
social media pages on there,
since they'll want to know more about you?

742
00:42:26,960 --> 00:42:29,230
For instance,
what if you have a YouTube channel or

743
00:42:29,230 --> 00:42:31,708
Instagram account dedicated
to your developer journey?

744
00:42:31,708 --> 00:42:37,845
>> Yeah, so social media,
again, in context, right?

745
00:42:37,845 --> 00:42:41,650
If your social media is you and
your family, that's really nice.

746
00:42:41,650 --> 00:42:43,328
Doesn't really add too much, to be honest.

747
00:42:43,328 --> 00:42:46,106
But like he said, if you do have a YouTube
channel where you're logging your whole

748
00:42:46,106 --> 00:42:48,097
experience, yeah,
that's definitely a highlight.

749
00:42:48,097 --> 00:42:53,661
It lets the other person take a quick look
at who you are in an even better way.

750
00:42:53,661 --> 00:42:55,010
So yeah, I'd say of course.

751
00:42:55,010 --> 00:42:55,630
>> Okay.

752
00:42:55,630 --> 00:42:57,340
>> So social media in context,
that's what I'm saying.

753
00:42:57,340 --> 00:42:58,568
>> In context, yeah, it's good.

754
00:42:58,568 --> 00:43:04,000
I would say there's a mix,
there's a mixed message or a little bit.

755
00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:08,914
You wanna be yourself but
at the same time,

756
00:43:08,914 --> 00:43:13,965
if you've got a lot of
personal stuff on your

757
00:43:13,965 --> 00:43:19,017
social media that could throw anybody off,

758
00:43:19,017 --> 00:43:22,309
you wanna think about that.

759
00:43:22,309 --> 00:43:23,582
And we're saying, be who you are,

760
00:43:23,582 --> 00:43:25,454
you shouldn't have to be
a certain way to get hired.

761
00:43:25,454 --> 00:43:30,837
But there is a fine line around what's the
right thing to put on social media or not.

762
00:43:30,837 --> 00:43:36,779
I think if you're in doubt,
don't include it, which I hate.

763
00:43:36,779 --> 00:43:41,590
All right, from Liz E,
as a new entry level web developer,

764
00:43:41,590 --> 00:43:44,970
is it possible to find fully remote work?

765
00:43:47,190 --> 00:43:50,569
>> So it was a lot harder
in January before COVID.

766
00:43:50,569 --> 00:43:55,389
Nowadays, it's getting a lot easier,
it's definitely getting a lot easier.

767
00:43:55,389 --> 00:43:56,838
There's definitely a lot more demand.

768
00:43:56,838 --> 00:44:00,842
One of the questions, at least if
you're in an interview process for

769
00:44:00,842 --> 00:44:05,134
a remote development, is ask them
what their process is for onboarding.

770
00:44:05,134 --> 00:44:08,417
One of the things that I've seen as well,
a lot of companies have gone remote.

771
00:44:08,417 --> 00:44:14,815
Their onboarding process is
still a little bit flaky, right?

772
00:44:14,815 --> 00:44:17,426
And that could just create some
difficulties when you're kind of

773
00:44:17,426 --> 00:44:18,710
onboarding and start working.

774
00:44:18,710 --> 00:44:23,480
So, I do think that it's becoming a lot
easier now than it was eight months ago,

775
00:44:23,480 --> 00:44:24,598
nine months ago,
>> Okay,

776
00:44:24,598 --> 00:44:29,948
we have Treehouse students around
the world, not just in the US.

777
00:44:29,948 --> 00:44:31,674
When people are doing their job search,

778
00:44:31,674 --> 00:44:34,523
what they need to think about as
far as their country of residence.

779
00:44:34,523 --> 00:44:36,180
Do you have any guidelines of that?

780
00:44:38,465 --> 00:44:41,336
>> Would you mean when applying for
a remote position?

781
00:44:41,336 --> 00:44:42,005
>> Yeah, so

782
00:44:42,005 --> 00:44:47,040
where is it just not worth applying
based on your country of residence?

783
00:44:48,290 --> 00:44:51,480
>> So, most of the time, you're gonna
wanna apply around the same give or

784
00:44:51,480 --> 00:44:54,620
take a couple of hours of your time zone,
all right?

785
00:44:54,620 --> 00:44:56,832
And even the places that do hire,

786
00:44:56,832 --> 00:45:00,156
try to also hire people
around the same time zone.

787
00:45:00,156 --> 00:45:05,350
So I'd keep that in mind, unless there's
a company that works around the clock.

788
00:45:05,350 --> 00:45:06,489
And then in that case it
doesn't really matter.

789
00:45:06,489 --> 00:45:09,743
But most of the time it's
the time zone consideration.

790
00:45:09,743 --> 00:45:13,110
Cuz they need you to be online
to be able to interact with you.

791
00:45:13,110 --> 00:45:15,711
So if you're on a completely
12 hour different time zone,

792
00:45:15,711 --> 00:45:18,475
it's just gonna make it a lot harder for
you and for them as well.

793
00:45:18,475 --> 00:45:23,055
Cuz you also need to reach out and
have questions and things like that.

794
00:45:23,055 --> 00:45:25,915
I'd also keep it in mind for
myself as well, not only for

795
00:45:25,915 --> 00:45:26,855
where I'm working, but for myself.

796
00:45:26,855 --> 00:45:31,682
>> Got it, and I would say that with all
of the uncertainty around H1B visas and

797
00:45:31,682 --> 00:45:36,132
all sorts of things going on in the US,
I think if you're a US citizen,

798
00:45:36,132 --> 00:45:37,657
stick to US companies.

799
00:45:37,657 --> 00:45:42,697
If you're not a US citizen,
try to find work in your own country.

800
00:45:42,697 --> 00:45:47,448
It's gonna be hard for a lot of US
companies to say yes to foreign

801
00:45:47,448 --> 00:45:50,508
folks right now, just be aware of that.

802
00:45:50,508 --> 00:45:55,250
>> And just to add to that,
the whole tax situation is always a thing.

803
00:45:55,250 --> 00:45:59,980
We kinda forget about that, but
taxes can also be a headache.

804
00:45:59,980 --> 00:46:01,167
So let's keep that in mind as well.

805
00:46:01,167 --> 00:46:05,050
If we work outside or even if we work as
sometimes contractors or things like that.

806
00:46:05,050 --> 00:46:06,960
>> Yeah, that's a good point to make.

807
00:46:06,960 --> 00:46:12,648
All right, from Brigitta, should we look
for internships before a junior role?

808
00:46:14,161 --> 00:46:20,680
>> I have seen more internships,
though this summer was kind of crazy.

809
00:46:20,680 --> 00:46:24,206
Even at the company where I work we
didn't have internships this summer with

810
00:46:24,206 --> 00:46:25,262
everything going on.

811
00:46:25,262 --> 00:46:29,507
I think they were kind of slow
because it of the situation.

812
00:46:29,507 --> 00:46:32,545
But I would definitely look for
internships.

813
00:46:32,545 --> 00:46:35,323
That's a great opportunity to
be able to get to try to learn,

814
00:46:35,323 --> 00:46:37,075
to add more to your portfolio, yeah.

815
00:46:37,075 --> 00:46:37,851
>> Got it.

816
00:46:37,851 --> 00:46:40,286
>> And they are out there, by the way,
there are good internships out there.

817
00:46:40,286 --> 00:46:45,090
>> I guess what's the big question around,
is it paid internship or not?

818
00:46:45,090 --> 00:46:47,658
Do you have any thoughts on whether you
should do it if it's paid or not paid?

819
00:46:47,658 --> 00:46:52,180
>> [COUGH] That depends on the person,
to be honest, right?

820
00:46:52,180 --> 00:46:55,765
If you can manage to take
an unpaid internship, right,

821
00:46:55,765 --> 00:47:00,208
and that's not gonna hurt you financially,
then I'd consider it.

822
00:47:00,208 --> 00:47:05,011
But if you can't,
I really wouldn't go through that.

823
00:47:05,011 --> 00:47:08,372
And I'd probably try to maybe
push a little bit more and

824
00:47:08,372 --> 00:47:09,960
try to find a paid job.

825
00:47:09,960 --> 00:47:11,786
>> Got it, okay, from Adrian.

826
00:47:11,786 --> 00:47:16,661
Do you think that the ten projects on
the tech degree on Team Treehouse is

827
00:47:16,661 --> 00:47:21,610
enough to have a portfolio to
get a junior position developer?

828
00:47:21,610 --> 00:47:24,531
Well, I don't know if you know enough
about our projects to answer that.

829
00:47:24,531 --> 00:47:29,240
But they're pretty typical projects
similar to what you do at a boot camp.

830
00:47:31,150 --> 00:47:34,430
>> So I would grab,
I mean ten is a lot of projects, right?

831
00:47:34,430 --> 00:47:36,255
So I would pick out maybe two or three.

832
00:47:36,255 --> 00:47:41,265
Give them your own style,
maybe give them some more functionality.

833
00:47:41,265 --> 00:47:47,107
A little bit more, give it your flavor and
then put them on your resume.

834
00:47:47,107 --> 00:47:50,309
Polish them a little bit more, you're
just focused on two, three, ten is a lot.

835
00:47:50,309 --> 00:47:53,251
You could share them, you can probably put
them on if you have a personal portfolio,

836
00:47:53,251 --> 00:47:54,463
it's a great place to share them.

837
00:47:54,463 --> 00:47:56,325
But on your resume,
you just wanna share maybe two or three,

838
00:47:56,325 --> 00:47:57,175
that's more than enough.

839
00:47:57,175 --> 00:47:59,899
>> Good call, and Adrian,
just so you know,

840
00:47:59,899 --> 00:48:03,620
we've designed those projects
to start off very simple.

841
00:48:03,620 --> 00:48:07,223
So the first chunk of those projects
aren't gonna be advanced enough for

842
00:48:07,223 --> 00:48:11,079
you to showcase on your resume, it's
really gonna be the later ones anyway.

843
00:48:11,079 --> 00:48:15,798
So I would echo Will saying, choose
the last two or three, customize them,

844
00:48:15,798 --> 00:48:17,959
really polish them and use those.

845
00:48:17,959 --> 00:48:21,119
And even better,
use them for, like we said,

846
00:48:21,119 --> 00:48:25,270
a local organization that
you're passionate for, right?

847
00:48:25,270 --> 00:48:27,310
So it's super real.

848
00:48:27,310 --> 00:48:31,047
So from Patricia, hello,
Will and Ryan, hello.

849
00:48:31,047 --> 00:48:34,794
What advice would you give someone
who's 40 plus entering this field for

850
00:48:34,794 --> 00:48:35,635
the first time?

851
00:48:39,163 --> 00:48:43,170
>> So leverage any previous
experience that you have, right?

852
00:48:43,170 --> 00:48:47,985
So you come into 40 plus,
you have some experience in some field,

853
00:48:47,985 --> 00:48:50,021
use that at your advantage.

854
00:48:50,021 --> 00:48:55,030
And it's kind of, the good thing is
development doesn't really discriminate.

855
00:48:55,030 --> 00:48:59,275
They talk a lot about ageism,
but I really haven't seen it.

856
00:48:59,275 --> 00:49:02,330
Might just been that I haven't seen it,
it does exist,

857
00:49:02,330 --> 00:49:04,479
I'm not gonna say it's not out there.

858
00:49:04,479 --> 00:49:08,803
But I think now with remote work,
kind of moving business to remote work,

859
00:49:08,803 --> 00:49:10,845
it kind of opens the possibility.

860
00:49:10,845 --> 00:49:13,276
So I would try to leverage,
to use this experience, and

861
00:49:13,276 --> 00:49:16,197
just kind of keep following
the process that we just talked about.

862
00:49:16,197 --> 00:49:19,531
>> Love it, I would echo that,
and also say, a good employer

863
00:49:19,531 --> 00:49:24,048
will actually realize you have life
experience and that's really valuable.

864
00:49:24,048 --> 00:49:29,777
So actually that you have tremendous
valuable experience you should pull on,

865
00:49:29,777 --> 00:49:30,394
right?

866
00:49:30,394 --> 00:49:33,555
Like Will is saying, figure out how
to talk about that experience and

867
00:49:33,555 --> 00:49:34,984
actually use as an advantage.

868
00:49:34,984 --> 00:49:36,255
>> And one more comment.

869
00:49:36,255 --> 00:49:40,670
Just one more comment to that, when you're
applying for a job, there's no need for

870
00:49:40,670 --> 00:49:42,450
you to tell them your age anyway.

871
00:49:42,450 --> 00:49:46,430
>> Yep, good call,
great answer, thank you.

872
00:49:47,910 --> 00:49:50,504
From Mel,
this might be more question for me.

873
00:49:50,504 --> 00:49:54,919
Spin off of the internship question,
most of the ones I've seen and

874
00:49:54,919 --> 00:49:58,820
applied for
asking what university I'm attending.

875
00:49:58,820 --> 00:50:02,780
Is it enough just to type in Treehouse,
or has anyone gotten an internship with

876
00:50:02,780 --> 00:50:07,401
just a Treehouse and
In the education field.

877
00:50:07,401 --> 00:50:11,626
I would say if they're asking
what university you're attending,

878
00:50:11,626 --> 00:50:15,920
it's not gonna work to say that
you're a Treehouse student.

879
00:50:15,920 --> 00:50:20,320
They're probably looking for
university students specifically, and

880
00:50:20,320 --> 00:50:22,494
they probably will filter you out.

881
00:50:22,494 --> 00:50:24,744
So I know that's an answer
you don't wanna hear, but

882
00:50:24,744 --> 00:50:26,508
that's probably what's gonna happen.

883
00:50:26,508 --> 00:50:33,380
I feel a little differently
than Will does on internships.

884
00:50:33,380 --> 00:50:37,740
I think they're generally not a good path.

885
00:50:37,740 --> 00:50:44,410
I would just go straight to your first
paid job, but I'm just being blunt.

886
00:50:44,410 --> 00:50:46,400
The projects you build are gonna be great,

887
00:50:46,400 --> 00:50:49,324
but you need to use it in the framework
that Will's talking about.

888
00:50:49,324 --> 00:50:53,960
Relying upon the word Treehouse
as your education is not

889
00:50:53,960 --> 00:50:55,080
gonna get you the job, right?

890
00:50:55,080 --> 00:50:56,480
It's the projects that matter.

891
00:50:57,780 --> 00:51:00,841
And if the internship is looking for
a university student, unfortunately,

892
00:51:00,841 --> 00:51:02,214
that's probably what they want.

893
00:51:02,214 --> 00:51:06,480
And so I would just skip it and
go to the next one.

894
00:51:06,480 --> 00:51:11,290
So from Aaron,
what about freelancing as experience?

895
00:51:12,920 --> 00:51:15,780
>> Yeah, I mean, that's [COUGH] kind of
these free projects that we're talking

896
00:51:15,780 --> 00:51:18,540
about, could eventually become
freelance opportunities.

897
00:51:18,540 --> 00:51:19,400
So you make that website for

898
00:51:19,400 --> 00:51:22,540
the restaurant we're talking about,
they get new stuff on their menu.

899
00:51:22,540 --> 00:51:26,250
Well now, you got a job or whatnot,
you have a little bit more experience, so

900
00:51:26,250 --> 00:51:29,190
that you can go back and be like hey,
we're gonna charge you for this, and

901
00:51:29,190 --> 00:51:30,890
there's nothing wrong.

902
00:51:30,890 --> 00:51:33,031
This is always a thing
with a lot of people,

903
00:51:33,031 --> 00:51:35,718
there's nothing wrong with charging for
your work.

904
00:51:35,718 --> 00:51:39,565
Also, do a little bit of research
on what kind of the hourly rate is,

905
00:51:39,565 --> 00:51:42,550
because we get excited,
and it's normal, right?

906
00:51:42,550 --> 00:51:44,582
We get excited,
we want that first paycheck.

907
00:51:44,582 --> 00:51:47,380
We'll lowball ourselves
to whatever number, and

908
00:51:47,380 --> 00:51:49,890
then what happens is our client will
just get accustomed to that number.

909
00:51:49,890 --> 00:51:51,615
It's gonna be really hard for
you to raise your price.

910
00:51:51,615 --> 00:51:53,320
So for the first time,
you can do for free.

911
00:51:53,320 --> 00:51:57,251
If they come back, they need some work,
go ahead, do a little bit of research, and

912
00:51:57,251 --> 00:51:58,671
come back with a more market.

913
00:51:58,671 --> 00:52:01,469
You can come a little lower,
but with a market number.

914
00:52:01,469 --> 00:52:02,846
I see that happen a lot.

915
00:52:02,846 --> 00:52:03,954
>> Thank you.

916
00:52:03,954 --> 00:52:08,724
From Armin, when making a portfolio, do
we strictly need to invent our own code?

917
00:52:08,724 --> 00:52:11,169
Or can we use pieces of
code from other people and

918
00:52:11,169 --> 00:52:13,810
make a portfolio using all
these pieces together?

919
00:52:15,380 --> 00:52:18,970
>> Yeah, I mean, in development,
we're not reinventing the wheel.

920
00:52:18,970 --> 00:52:24,190
So it's not so much as you're copying code
is how you're using this code together,

921
00:52:25,220 --> 00:52:26,210
same thing with music.

922
00:52:27,720 --> 00:52:28,490
There's no new notes.

923
00:52:28,490 --> 00:52:29,340
It's a combination of notes.

924
00:52:30,480 --> 00:52:32,373
And we get new music, right?

925
00:52:32,373 --> 00:52:34,680
So same idea, same concept.

926
00:52:34,680 --> 00:52:36,230
>> Appreciate that.

927
00:52:36,230 --> 00:52:39,518
I think just-
>> Jeff, just to add to that,

928
00:52:39,518 --> 00:52:42,965
just make sure you understand
the code that you are doing.

929
00:52:42,965 --> 00:52:44,335
>> Yes.
>> Because if somebody comes back and

930
00:52:44,335 --> 00:52:46,693
asks you about something about
a piece of code, why did you use this?

931
00:52:46,693 --> 00:52:47,355
Why did you use that?

932
00:52:47,355 --> 00:52:50,050
You wanna be able to provide an answer.

933
00:52:51,450 --> 00:52:54,540
>> Amen, yeah,
that's vital to be able to do that.

934
00:52:54,540 --> 00:52:58,156
From Raphael, as someone changing
careers and learning by Treehouse,

935
00:52:58,156 --> 00:52:59,579
what should I be prepared for

936
00:52:59,579 --> 00:53:03,212
in a technical style interview if
I'm applying for junior deposition?

937
00:53:03,212 --> 00:53:04,350
We talked a little bit about that.

938
00:53:04,350 --> 00:53:06,700
But why don't you
reiterate that real quick?

939
00:53:06,700 --> 00:53:08,910
>> So you can expect other whiteboarding,
right?

940
00:53:08,910 --> 00:53:11,730
And most of whiteboadings are gonna
probably be some type of algorithm.

941
00:53:11,730 --> 00:53:13,100
So I would study up.

942
00:53:14,380 --> 00:53:18,820
I would go through the process of
learning, reading a couple of books.

943
00:53:18,820 --> 00:53:23,360
The Cracking the Coding Interview is
a pretty good one off the top of my head,

944
00:53:23,360 --> 00:53:25,040
Reading Clean Code.

945
00:53:25,040 --> 00:53:29,318
I think one is called JavaScript Samurai,
I believe,

946
00:53:29,318 --> 00:53:33,512
just researching,
you would expect probably that.

947
00:53:33,512 --> 00:53:36,882
I would use some of these platforms that
kinda give you a couple of problems, and

948
00:53:36,882 --> 00:53:37,850
try to do it yourself.

949
00:53:39,000 --> 00:53:42,180
Code I think, or
leak code are some of these things.

950
00:53:42,180 --> 00:53:43,600
Try to practice.

951
00:53:43,600 --> 00:53:45,302
So building projects is
gonna give you practice.

952
00:53:45,302 --> 00:53:47,422
Try to actually go through
practicing products.

953
00:53:47,422 --> 00:53:49,586
All these things are the things
that will add you up, and

954
00:53:49,586 --> 00:53:52,080
will make it a lot easier when
you go to these interviews.

955
00:53:52,080 --> 00:53:53,480
>> Great, thank you.

956
00:53:53,480 --> 00:53:55,540
We'll try to blaze through
the rest of these.

957
00:53:55,540 --> 00:53:57,130
We're getting low on time.

958
00:53:57,130 --> 00:54:00,942
From Melissa,
could we hear more about cold emailing?

959
00:54:00,942 --> 00:54:04,187
How do you recommend
approaching this tactic?

960
00:54:04,187 --> 00:54:07,905
>> Yeah, so you wanna research
the company that you wanna apply to.

961
00:54:07,905 --> 00:54:10,860
You wanna research the people
that make decisions.

962
00:54:10,860 --> 00:54:14,105
Or you probably wanna find the people that
make decisions on the development team,

963
00:54:14,105 --> 00:54:16,230
cuz that's probably where you're applying.

964
00:54:16,230 --> 00:54:21,797
I would try to tailor the email to again,
to what they do, present yourself.

965
00:54:21,797 --> 00:54:25,953
And try to find a project, or try to find
some type of code, or something that you

966
00:54:25,953 --> 00:54:30,064
can share with them, and not only show
your interest as to why you wanna apply.

967
00:54:30,064 --> 00:54:33,230
But also, have a little bit more of
that effort that we talked about.

968
00:54:33,230 --> 00:54:34,520
And that would be great.

969
00:54:34,520 --> 00:54:35,407
And sometimes, it's very easy.

970
00:54:35,407 --> 00:54:38,490
You could just do a simple inspect on
their page, and they have a little error.

971
00:54:38,490 --> 00:54:39,780
And you can just highlight that, right?

972
00:54:39,780 --> 00:54:42,040
Just, again,
bringing some points of conversation.

973
00:54:42,040 --> 00:54:45,190
So they can see that you're
not only invested in them, but

974
00:54:45,190 --> 00:54:47,820
you really wanna be
a part of that company.

975
00:54:47,820 --> 00:54:50,382
>> I love it, thank you.

976
00:54:50,382 --> 00:54:56,450
From Adam, has anyone devalued the way
you gained your knowledge of programming?

977
00:54:56,450 --> 00:54:59,430
Are there companies that don't believe
in boot camps and online learning?

978
00:55:00,580 --> 00:55:01,774
>> Yeah, yeah, there are.

979
00:55:01,774 --> 00:55:06,620
But I mean, there's all type of people in
the world, so it doesn't really matter.

980
00:55:06,620 --> 00:55:07,460
>> Got it.

981
00:55:07,460 --> 00:55:08,155
How can you tell?

982
00:55:08,155 --> 00:55:10,617
I mean, how can you avoid those companies?

983
00:55:10,617 --> 00:55:18,435
I mean, you can look at the people that
work there, that would be a great way.

984
00:55:18,435 --> 00:55:22,015
See if you can see people that do
have boot camp experience, or not.

985
00:55:22,015 --> 00:55:23,655
That would be a great tell.

986
00:55:23,655 --> 00:55:25,438
Or maybe if they all come
from a CS background,

987
00:55:25,438 --> 00:55:27,465
then they're most likely
only want people with CS.

988
00:55:27,465 --> 00:55:28,589
And again, it does happen, but

989
00:55:28,589 --> 00:55:31,495
there's a bunch of companies out
there that wouldn't really work.

990
00:55:31,495 --> 00:55:32,077
It wouldn't [INAUDIBLE].

991
00:55:32,077 --> 00:55:33,495
>> Okay, great.

992
00:55:35,870 --> 00:55:39,180
I'm a beginner, but I'm really enjoying
and appreciating Team Treehouse.

993
00:55:39,180 --> 00:55:39,890
Thanks, Lisa.

994
00:55:39,890 --> 00:55:43,370
Thank you so much for
this informative session.

995
00:55:43,370 --> 00:55:45,620
Does age matter when applying for
employment?

996
00:55:45,620 --> 00:55:49,530
If so, how can a [INAUDIBLE] thank you.

997
00:55:49,530 --> 00:55:50,760
>> It shouldn't, it really shouldn't.

998
00:55:50,760 --> 00:55:53,300
Again, there's no need for
them to ask your age, so.

999
00:55:54,590 --> 00:55:59,280
>> Yep, and I think and
they can see how old you are.

1000
00:55:59,280 --> 00:56:02,410
Use that to your advantage,
whether it's young or old.

1001
00:56:02,410 --> 00:56:07,410
Pull on that tech strength
versus a weakness.

1002
00:56:07,410 --> 00:56:09,870
Let's tackle two more.

1003
00:56:09,870 --> 00:56:13,590
From Adam, how do you manage the workload
while still working a nine to five and

1004
00:56:13,590 --> 00:56:14,900
learning new technologies?

1005
00:56:16,990 --> 00:56:18,670
>> For me, it was scheduling.

1006
00:56:18,670 --> 00:56:23,142
Of course, you have to find a process,
right, that works.

1007
00:56:23,142 --> 00:56:26,640
And for me, it was just scheduling,
scheduling my time as best as possible.

1008
00:56:26,640 --> 00:56:30,192
So I was able and
kinda focusing on that time, right?

1009
00:56:30,192 --> 00:56:33,242
If you said you're gonna work for
two hours or whatever at night,

1010
00:56:33,242 --> 00:56:37,013
turn off your phone, turn off your social
media, and just dedicate yourself for

1011
00:56:37,013 --> 00:56:38,030
that amount of time.

1012
00:56:39,030 --> 00:56:40,080
>> How did they interview?

1013
00:56:40,080 --> 00:56:43,710
So Leanne said, how did they
do interviews for remote work?

1014
00:56:43,710 --> 00:56:44,800
Is it on Zoom?

1015
00:56:44,800 --> 00:56:46,430
I've only heard about
interviews in person,

1016
00:56:46,430 --> 00:56:49,050
and they literally watch you build
whatever they want you to build for them.

1017
00:56:50,750 --> 00:56:51,620
>> Very similar.

1018
00:56:51,620 --> 00:56:54,850
I've actually gone through
that process recently.

1019
00:56:54,850 --> 00:56:56,070
So a lot of it is online.

1020
00:56:56,070 --> 00:56:58,240
There's a couple of code editors
online where the other person can

1021
00:56:58,240 --> 00:56:59,480
look at what you type.

1022
00:56:59,480 --> 00:57:02,400
And then you got your classic Zoom call,
and you're both on a Zoom call,

1023
00:57:02,400 --> 00:57:07,000
and kinda going over this code editor,
building something got it, yeah.

1024
00:57:07,000 --> 00:57:08,215
>> Okay, cool.

1025
00:57:08,215 --> 00:57:10,070
Well, that's all we have time for.

1026
00:57:10,070 --> 00:57:14,630
Thank you so much for
spending your valuable time with us.

1027
00:57:14,630 --> 00:57:18,840
Any parting message you
wanna give anybody?

1028
00:57:18,840 --> 00:57:22,548
>> Imposter syndrome exists,
just wanna let everybody know.

1029
00:57:22,548 --> 00:57:26,196
So I just went through an overview
right now, just, again,

1030
00:57:26,196 --> 00:57:28,960
to keep conversations and things.

1031
00:57:28,960 --> 00:57:31,895
And you always feel in position.

1032
00:57:31,895 --> 00:57:36,250
You're always gonna feel
like you're not there yet.

1033
00:57:36,250 --> 00:57:39,290
Even with the amount of experience I have,
I still get that feeling.

1034
00:57:39,290 --> 00:57:41,240
You just learned to kinda
control that monster.

1035
00:57:41,240 --> 00:57:42,340
I know that it's gonna come,

1036
00:57:42,340 --> 00:57:45,320
it's gonna rear its head every
time you wanna try something new.

1037
00:57:45,320 --> 00:57:48,170
It doesn't go away, but
you learn to know that it exists.

1038
00:57:48,170 --> 00:57:52,136
So if I wanna leave anybody with some
advice, it's just, it's not gonna go away.

1039
00:57:52,136 --> 00:57:59,260
You're gonna learn to tame it,
and coding is about grinding.

1040
00:57:59,260 --> 00:58:00,440
It's not so much about memory.

1041
00:58:00,440 --> 00:58:02,140
It's not so much about being smart.

1042
00:58:02,140 --> 00:58:03,940
It is about effort.

1043
00:58:03,940 --> 00:58:04,857
It is about you gotta keep going.

1044
00:58:04,857 --> 00:58:05,917
You're gonna hit a couple of walls.

1045
00:58:05,917 --> 00:58:06,900
You're gonna get frustrating.

1046
00:58:06,900 --> 00:58:08,010
That's not gonna change.

1047
00:58:08,010 --> 00:58:10,640
But just keep going,
there is light at the end of the tunnel,

1048
00:58:10,640 --> 00:58:12,710
and everybody can do it, yeah.

1049
00:58:12,710 --> 00:58:13,300
>> Thank you, Will.