1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,400 [Treehouse Friends] 2 00:00:03,400 --> 00:00:05,200 >>All right, Chris, thanks for being with us today. 3 00:00:05,200 --> 00:00:07,680 To start off, let's talk about--a little bit about who you are, 4 00:00:07,680 --> 00:00:10,020 what you do, what you've done, 5 00:00:10,020 --> 00:00:12,620 and how you've ended up at Google Ventures today. 6 00:00:12,620 --> 00:00:17,270 >>Out of college, I decided to go to New York and work at an investment bank. 7 00:00:17,270 --> 00:00:20,260 I chose one that was focused on tech, 8 00:00:20,260 --> 00:00:22,360 because I had always been passionate about tech. 9 00:00:22,360 --> 00:00:24,090 I was the kid with the computer, 10 00:00:24,090 --> 00:00:27,290 locking myself in my room, being a complete nerd in high school and middle school 11 00:00:27,290 --> 00:00:29,320 and all that. 12 00:00:29,320 --> 00:00:33,440 And I guess I didn't really know what investment banking really involved. 13 00:00:33,440 --> 00:00:36,460 No one at my university went to an investment bank, 14 00:00:36,460 --> 00:00:39,390 but I thought all my friends that were on the East Coast 15 00:00:39,390 --> 00:00:42,530 at Ivy League schools said that was the job to get. 16 00:00:42,530 --> 00:00:45,040 So it was fun, I learned a lot, 17 00:00:45,040 --> 00:00:48,670 but at the end of the day, it kind of doesn't support the entrepreneurial mind 18 00:00:48,670 --> 00:00:49,750 if you will. 19 00:00:49,750 --> 00:00:52,440 I ended up determining that it wasn't the right fit for me 20 00:00:52,440 --> 00:00:53,830 for me. 21 00:00:53,830 --> 00:00:55,260 >>Right, okay. 22 00:00:55,260 --> 00:00:57,170 So how did that transition into you moving into tech? 23 00:00:57,170 --> 00:01:00,130 >>Yeah, so--and then I switched, 24 00:01:00,130 --> 00:01:02,250 because I thought management consulting might be better. 25 00:01:02,250 --> 00:01:04,480 It was the exact same. 26 00:01:04,480 --> 00:01:05,820 >>Still in New York? 27 00:01:05,820 --> 00:01:08,450 >>Still in New York, but I had managed to convince the manager at the consulting firm I worked for 28 00:01:08,450 --> 00:01:10,910 to transfer me out to California. 29 00:01:10,910 --> 00:01:12,440 So they moved me out to California 30 00:01:12,440 --> 00:01:15,470 and then about a month or 2 months later, 31 00:01:15,470 --> 00:01:20,060 I was part of the end of 2008 layoff season, if you will. 32 00:01:20,060 --> 00:01:23,100 Here I am in San Francisco, just moved here, 33 00:01:23,100 --> 00:01:26,010 not sure what I want to do, laid off, 34 00:01:26,010 --> 00:01:28,180 trying to figure out what would be fun to do, 35 00:01:28,180 --> 00:01:30,590 and I ended up coming up with the idea 36 00:01:30,590 --> 00:01:33,430 to start a conference called Laid Off Camp. 37 00:01:33,430 --> 00:01:37,260 So my first kind of foray into the Bay Area 38 00:01:37,260 --> 00:01:40,480 tech scene was doing a conference called Laid Off Camp, 39 00:01:40,480 --> 00:01:43,170 which was kind of a spin on a bar camp, 40 00:01:43,170 --> 00:01:46,140 which is kind of like a tech "un conference," if you will. 41 00:01:46,140 --> 00:01:50,050 So that was my first foray in technology in the Bay Area 42 00:01:50,050 --> 00:01:53,550 and we put on an event about 1,000 people, 43 00:01:53,550 --> 00:01:56,420 then I put another one on in LA, another one on in New York, 44 00:01:56,420 --> 00:01:58,840 and then I had to open source the model. 45 00:01:58,840 --> 00:02:00,190 People were putting them on all around the country, 46 00:02:00,190 --> 00:02:02,500 on their own, 47 00:02:02,500 --> 00:02:04,320 and that was kind of the first way that I kind of 48 00:02:04,320 --> 00:02:06,690 built a brand that I was associated with. 49 00:02:06,690 --> 00:02:09,949 >>Did you meet Kevin through Laid Off Camp? 50 00:02:09,949 --> 00:02:12,430 How did--walk us through how it led to-- 51 00:02:12,430 --> 00:02:13,960 >>How it got to Milk. 52 00:02:13,960 --> 00:02:16,370 >>There's another company in between. 53 00:02:16,370 --> 00:02:18,490 >>So, the first person I met 54 00:02:18,490 --> 00:02:21,490 kind of in the Bay Area tech scene was a guy named Matt Van Horn. 55 00:02:21,490 --> 00:02:23,850 He's now the VP of Business at Path, 56 00:02:23,850 --> 00:02:25,160 and he had worked at Digg, 57 00:02:25,160 --> 00:02:27,760 so Matt was the way I kind of met some people at Digg 58 00:02:27,760 --> 00:02:29,150 and at this point, 59 00:02:29,150 --> 00:02:33,070 I wasn't connected to anyone really that I started Milk with, 60 00:02:33,070 --> 00:02:35,460 but slowly through rock climbing, actually, 61 00:02:35,460 --> 00:02:38,170 is how I ended up meeting Daniel and Jeff, 62 00:02:38,170 --> 00:02:40,250 who are both 63 00:02:40,250 --> 00:02:42,220 early co-founders at Milk, 64 00:02:42,220 --> 00:02:44,780 and so I spent the next year 65 00:02:44,780 --> 00:02:47,120 kind of doing some freelance work 66 00:02:47,120 --> 00:02:49,800 and just meeting people and trying to figure out what I wanted to do. 67 00:02:49,800 --> 00:02:51,400 >>That freelance work, was it coding? 68 00:02:51,400 --> 00:02:54,190 >>No, I was helping people throw events, 69 00:02:54,190 --> 00:02:57,200 I was helping people do financial forecasting. 70 00:02:57,200 --> 00:02:59,340 It was really anything that someone needed help with, 71 00:02:59,340 --> 00:03:01,350 I was helping out with. 72 00:03:01,350 --> 00:03:03,780 And then, finally, I decided 73 00:03:03,780 --> 00:03:05,580 and this is totally off topic, 74 00:03:05,580 --> 00:03:07,490 took a 7-1/2 month trip with my now wife 75 00:03:07,490 --> 00:03:08,890 and traveled around the world. 76 00:03:08,890 --> 00:03:09,510 >>Okay, very nice. 77 00:03:09,510 --> 00:03:11,510 >>Came back 78 00:03:11,510 --> 00:03:14,340 and I had submitted a talk to South by Southwest 79 00:03:14,340 --> 00:03:16,770 that was about being laid off 80 00:03:16,770 --> 00:03:19,210 in the tech community, 81 00:03:19,210 --> 00:03:21,660 and that talk--and our trip ended 82 00:03:21,660 --> 00:03:23,410 going to South by, 83 00:03:23,410 --> 00:03:26,380 and at South by, I was like, "Alright, now's my time." 84 00:03:26,380 --> 00:03:28,340 I need to figure out what I want to do. 85 00:03:28,340 --> 00:03:30,450 My goal was to get a job at a start up. 86 00:03:30,450 --> 00:03:33,800 I wanted to work at a start up that people recognized, that had a great brand, 87 00:03:33,800 --> 00:03:35,890 that had a bunch of great engineers. 88 00:03:35,890 --> 00:03:38,610 I wanted to position myself for what was next, 89 00:03:38,610 --> 00:03:40,900 which was could we start a company? 90 00:03:40,900 --> 00:03:42,120 Join another--I didn't know, 91 00:03:42,120 --> 00:03:44,580 but I figured if I could work with smart engineers 92 00:03:44,580 --> 00:03:47,160 at a company that people recognize, that'd be good. 93 00:03:47,160 --> 00:03:49,130 And that company was SimpleGeo. 94 00:03:49,130 --> 00:03:51,370 >>Okay, what did they do--what did you do, rather? 95 00:03:51,370 --> 00:03:55,580 >>SimpleGeo was a location data service provider. 96 00:03:55,580 --> 00:03:59,440 They basically made developers' lives easy when they wanted to do location stuff 97 00:03:59,440 --> 00:04:01,940 in mobile and web applications. 98 00:04:01,940 --> 00:04:04,300 I honestly, when I was trying to work there, 99 00:04:04,300 --> 00:04:06,230 still didn't know what they did. 100 00:04:06,230 --> 00:04:09,600 I tried to figure it out; it was all API. 101 00:04:09,600 --> 00:04:11,280 I was not a developer, 102 00:04:11,280 --> 00:04:13,110 but I got the space; 103 00:04:13,110 --> 00:04:15,760 I just didn't get their product, and I just-- 104 00:04:15,760 --> 00:04:18,149 I met with their CEO, who I'd been introduced to. 105 00:04:18,149 --> 00:04:20,339 I met with the person they'd just hired in business development, 106 00:04:20,339 --> 00:04:22,210 and I was like, "I want to work here," 107 00:04:22,210 --> 00:04:24,500 and I had learned that if you are non-technical, 108 00:04:24,500 --> 00:04:26,350 and you don't want to do sales, 109 00:04:26,350 --> 00:04:28,260 you need a job in business development. 110 00:04:28,260 --> 00:04:30,190 Like, that's the role; if someone's like, "What do you do?" 111 00:04:30,190 --> 00:04:32,280 and you're like, "Oh, I'm not a designer and I'm not a coder," 112 00:04:32,280 --> 00:04:34,190 and it's kind of like what does that mean? 113 00:04:34,190 --> 00:04:36,570 Well, if you're not a salesperson, then you do BD. 114 00:04:36,570 --> 00:04:38,630 And I just wasn't a-- 115 00:04:38,630 --> 00:04:41,140 like I like selling, but I didn't want to just sell. 116 00:04:41,140 --> 00:04:43,180 I wanted to build something, 117 00:04:43,180 --> 00:04:45,120 and so BD seemed like where I could do that. 118 00:04:45,120 --> 00:04:46,220 >>Okay. 119 00:04:46,220 --> 00:04:50,240 >>So I worked at SimpleGeo for about a year, a little less, 120 00:04:50,240 --> 00:04:52,780 and at South by Southwest again, 121 00:04:52,780 --> 00:04:55,050 Kevin and I got connected, because he asked around for 122 00:04:55,050 --> 00:04:57,320 who's a good BD guy, 123 00:04:57,320 --> 00:05:01,080 got introduced to me, and we all decided to start Milk right around South by that year. 124 00:05:01,080 --> 00:05:03,450 >>Interesting. 125 00:05:03,450 --> 00:05:05,070 How did the idea for Milk come about? 126 00:05:05,070 --> 00:05:08,050 Well, let's talk about that first. 127 00:05:08,050 --> 00:05:10,110 >>So the idea came about, 128 00:05:10,110 --> 00:05:12,310 because didn't actually have an idea. 129 00:05:12,310 --> 00:05:14,270 Right, so Milk originally, 130 00:05:14,270 --> 00:05:17,150 Kevin and Daniel had always said, "We should start a company together." 131 00:05:17,150 --> 00:05:19,860 They'd had this vision since they worked together at Digg, 132 00:05:19,860 --> 00:05:21,130 and they had been playing with ideas, 133 00:05:21,130 --> 00:05:23,370 but they never really knew, 134 00:05:23,370 --> 00:05:25,240 it wasn't, "I have this great idea; let's go build it." 135 00:05:25,240 --> 00:05:27,260 It was, "We want to work together." 136 00:05:27,260 --> 00:05:29,300 And so Kevin and Daniel brought on Jeff, brought on me, 137 00:05:29,300 --> 00:05:31,530 brought on 2 other IOS engineers, 138 00:05:31,530 --> 00:05:33,450 and we kind of brought together a team of people 139 00:05:33,450 --> 00:05:36,320 that wanted to work together and build something cool, 140 00:05:36,320 --> 00:05:39,280 and we raised our first round on that idea alone. 141 00:05:39,280 --> 00:05:41,460 Like, we didn't have a business idea. 142 00:05:41,460 --> 00:05:43,270 We had a few things we were playing with, 143 00:05:43,270 --> 00:05:45,250 but we weren't sure what the big idea would be. 144 00:05:45,250 --> 00:05:47,220 >>So let's talk about, like, 145 00:05:47,220 --> 00:05:49,020 how did you manage to raise a round 146 00:05:49,020 --> 00:05:51,360 without having an idea? 147 00:05:51,360 --> 00:05:53,370 For people out there who think you need to have an idea there 148 00:05:53,370 --> 00:05:56,550 and have to have a business plan in place and all that stuff done. 149 00:05:56,550 --> 00:05:58,380 >>The short answer is 150 00:05:58,380 --> 00:06:00,210 you be Kevin Rose. 151 00:06:00,210 --> 00:06:03,080 So the real answer is, you need an idea. 152 00:06:03,080 --> 00:06:06,430 Like, if somebody e-mailed me and wasn't a Kevin Rose or a Kevin Systrom 153 00:06:06,430 --> 00:06:08,110 or an Evan Williams and was like, 154 00:06:08,110 --> 00:06:11,700 "I would like to raise a round of financial from you and Google Ventures," 155 00:06:11,700 --> 00:06:13,940 I would be like, "No." 156 00:06:13,940 --> 00:06:15,370 It just doesn't work like that. 157 00:06:15,370 --> 00:06:17,320 >>Right, so you need to have past success? 158 00:06:17,320 --> 00:06:21,330 >>Yeah, and we've done some studies at Google Ventures 159 00:06:21,330 --> 00:06:24,480 and the general investing ecosystem has, as well, 160 00:06:24,480 --> 00:06:26,630 and past successes 161 00:06:26,630 --> 00:06:28,100 is a very key indicator 162 00:06:28,100 --> 00:06:30,310 for future successes. 163 00:06:30,310 --> 00:06:32,740 So that's one of the reasons we do that, 164 00:06:32,740 --> 00:06:34,270 but that's a very unusual circumstance 165 00:06:34,270 --> 00:06:36,960 to be able to raise a round without anything. 166 00:06:36,960 --> 00:06:38,550 But we did have a tech team 167 00:06:38,550 --> 00:06:41,290 and if that's the first step, right? 168 00:06:41,290 --> 00:06:43,500 Like you can build a product. 169 00:06:43,500 --> 00:06:45,430 You have a team that can build a product, 170 00:06:45,430 --> 00:06:47,590 and you have some ideas. 171 00:06:47,590 --> 00:06:50,610 Most companies just need to spend a month, build something, and then raise a round. 172 00:06:50,610 --> 00:06:54,480 We were just fortunate because of Kevin and Daniel 173 00:06:54,480 --> 00:06:56,410 and who the team (inaudible-speaking at the same time), right. 174 00:06:56,410 --> 00:06:58,590 >>So what were some of the difficulties you ran into 175 00:06:58,590 --> 00:07:01,100 when starting Milk, from a business perspective? 176 00:07:01,100 --> 00:07:03,800 >>Yeah, so my role was the business guy, 177 00:07:03,800 --> 00:07:05,950 like we had engineers, developers, designers. 178 00:07:05,950 --> 00:07:07,370 Like and then Kevin, 179 00:07:07,370 --> 00:07:09,720 and then I was in charge of everything else. 180 00:07:09,720 --> 00:07:11,440 So in the early days, 181 00:07:11,440 --> 00:07:13,760 I came in, and I was like, "Alright, we don't have payroll. 182 00:07:13,760 --> 00:07:15,230 We don't have a bank account. 183 00:07:15,230 --> 00:07:18,430 We don't have any filings with California. 184 00:07:18,430 --> 00:07:20,700 We don't--literally, we had nothing. 185 00:07:20,700 --> 00:07:24,550 So we took an approach early on 186 00:07:24,550 --> 00:07:27,260 and there's reasons, too, not to do this, 187 00:07:27,260 --> 00:07:30,100 to kind of do everything in a way that would scale. 188 00:07:30,100 --> 00:07:33,930 So depending on how much money a company has, 189 00:07:33,930 --> 00:07:36,500 I would advise to or not to do this, 190 00:07:36,500 --> 00:07:38,420 but we hired a law firm. 191 00:07:38,420 --> 00:07:40,190 We hired an accounting firm. 192 00:07:40,190 --> 00:07:44,550 Things that probably cost more than they needed to 193 00:07:44,550 --> 00:07:46,860 in the first 6 months, 194 00:07:46,860 --> 00:07:50,300 but that--when we grew 195 00:07:50,300 --> 00:07:52,980 and eventually when we were getting--going through negotiations with Google, 196 00:07:52,980 --> 00:07:55,310 it made it so seamless. 197 00:07:55,310 --> 00:07:58,090 We didn't have to go create financial statements to send in. 198 00:07:58,090 --> 00:08:00,810 We didn't have to make sure our docs were in order. 199 00:08:00,810 --> 00:08:02,450 And so the cost might have been 200 00:08:02,450 --> 00:08:04,410 10, 20, $30,000 201 00:08:04,410 --> 00:08:07,490 all in for the first year for legal 202 00:08:07,490 --> 00:08:09,360 and finance and accounting, 203 00:08:09,360 --> 00:08:11,540 but for us, it was worth it. 204 00:08:11,540 --> 00:08:13,600 So my job getting in was, 205 00:08:13,600 --> 00:08:15,860 alright, who is going to manage our HR? 206 00:08:15,860 --> 00:08:17,830 Who is going to manage our accounting? 207 00:08:17,830 --> 00:08:19,260 How do I set that up? 208 00:08:19,260 --> 00:08:21,340 >>For founders out there, 209 00:08:21,340 --> 00:08:24,070 should--who don't have a start up round necessarily, 210 00:08:24,070 --> 00:08:26,410 should they take the time out to learn accounting, 211 00:08:26,410 --> 00:08:28,370 finance, the legal stuff, 212 00:08:28,370 --> 00:08:30,080 or should they just 213 00:08:30,080 --> 00:08:32,730 not necessarily hire a law firm or an accounting firm, 214 00:08:32,730 --> 00:08:34,730 but hire someone onto the team who can do that? 215 00:08:34,730 --> 00:08:36,980 >>For any company, 216 00:08:36,980 --> 00:08:38,679 it's good for someone at the company 217 00:08:38,679 --> 00:08:40,490 to understand the fundamentals. 218 00:08:40,490 --> 00:08:42,960 Does someone need to go learn how to use Quickbooks? 219 00:08:42,960 --> 00:08:44,450 Absolutely not. 220 00:08:44,450 --> 00:08:47,210 From most companies that we see at Google Ventures, 221 00:08:47,210 --> 00:08:50,720 like the accounting that they have in place 222 00:08:50,720 --> 00:08:52,750 for the first 6 months is almost nothing, 223 00:08:52,750 --> 00:08:54,560 and that's fine, 224 00:08:54,560 --> 00:08:57,040 but for someone to understand what that means 225 00:08:57,040 --> 00:08:59,260 and what that will mean down the road 226 00:08:59,260 --> 00:09:02,650 and understand why it's important to have 227 00:09:02,650 --> 00:09:05,060 your formation docs 228 00:09:05,060 --> 00:09:08,760 and filing your--all your tax documents 229 00:09:08,760 --> 00:09:11,210 for your stock purchase agreements and all that stuff 230 00:09:11,210 --> 00:09:13,020 done right, 231 00:09:13,020 --> 00:09:14,890 it's important to understand that 232 00:09:14,890 --> 00:09:17,900 as a co-founder or founder of a company should take the time to learn that, 233 00:09:17,900 --> 00:09:20,300 but that's something you can learn in a few days, 234 00:09:20,300 --> 00:09:23,250 having a conversation with friends and that kind of stuff. 235 00:09:23,250 --> 00:09:26,140 But do you need to hire a business person 236 00:09:26,140 --> 00:09:28,270 to run your company? 237 00:09:28,270 --> 00:09:30,360 It just depends on what you're building. 238 00:09:30,360 --> 00:09:33,810 It's good to have 1 person that's at least familiar with it. 239 00:09:33,810 --> 00:09:36,500 >>So I watched a talk once. 240 00:09:36,500 --> 00:09:38,470 I think it was the CofMid.com, 241 00:09:38,470 --> 00:09:40,300 and he said that when he was raising his round, 242 00:09:40,300 --> 00:09:43,430 he was told that for every non-tech guy that you have 243 00:09:43,430 --> 00:09:45,340 in a tech start up, 244 00:09:45,340 --> 00:09:47,820 it decreases the valuation of the company. 245 00:09:47,820 --> 00:09:49,370 First off, is that true? 246 00:09:49,370 --> 00:09:50,540 No. 247 00:09:50,540 --> 00:09:52,330 >>Okay, because he said, 248 00:09:52,330 --> 00:09:55,350 I think his numbers were $250,000 for everyone that was 249 00:09:55,350 --> 00:09:58,500 not a tech person was deducted 250 00:09:58,500 --> 00:10:01,310 >>From the purchase price of the company-- 251 00:10:01,310 --> 00:10:03,280 >>The valuation of the company. 252 00:10:03,280 --> 00:10:05,270 >>There's a million examples of why that's not true. 253 00:10:05,270 --> 00:10:08,220 Like if you took all the non-technical people out of sales force, 254 00:10:08,220 --> 00:10:10,200 like they would have no revenue, 255 00:10:10,200 --> 00:10:12,880 or they would, but it wouldn't be growing at all. 256 00:10:12,880 --> 00:10:15,890 So you can't--there's not way to blanket state 257 00:10:15,890 --> 00:10:17,070 that that's the case. 258 00:10:17,070 --> 00:10:19,360 I know that had 259 00:10:19,360 --> 00:10:22,030 we done during acquisition talks, 260 00:10:22,030 --> 00:10:25,940 I know that if you took a person who was a non-technical person 261 00:10:25,940 --> 00:10:27,230 out of the mix 262 00:10:27,230 --> 00:10:29,450 in a lot of scenarios, 263 00:10:29,450 --> 00:10:31,260 like that kind of company would be worth less, 264 00:10:31,260 --> 00:10:34,250 like if some company came to me 265 00:10:34,250 --> 00:10:37,890 and they have 4 co-founders, and it's an engineer and 3 business people, 266 00:10:37,890 --> 00:10:41,160 is that less, usually less desirable 267 00:10:41,160 --> 00:10:43,790 than 3 engineers and 1 business person? 268 00:10:43,790 --> 00:10:46,180 Yes, like at an early stage, 269 00:10:46,180 --> 00:10:48,180 there should be more engineers 270 00:10:48,180 --> 00:10:50,670 than business people, 271 00:10:50,670 --> 00:10:52,800 but that doesn't mean that there should be barely-- 272 00:10:52,800 --> 00:10:54,500 >>It's not necessarily a bad thing. 273 00:10:54,500 --> 00:10:56,470 Okay, yeah, let's take a step back, 274 00:10:56,470 --> 00:10:57,580 because I forgot to ask this, 275 00:10:57,580 --> 00:10:59,230 but what are some of the difficulties 276 00:10:59,230 --> 00:11:03,190 you personally ran into on the business side when starting up Milk? 277 00:11:03,190 --> 00:11:05,380 >>Yeah, so I think 278 00:11:05,380 --> 00:11:08,280 one of the biggest difficulties was just keeping everything in order, right? 279 00:11:08,280 --> 00:11:11,000 You've got documents that need to be signed by everyone. 280 00:11:11,000 --> 00:11:14,430 You've got paychecks that need to be issued, 281 00:11:14,430 --> 00:11:17,100 and it's just really important to kind of set aside 282 00:11:17,100 --> 00:11:19,240 like here on this day of the week, 283 00:11:19,240 --> 00:11:23,150 like I'm going to make sure that all the payroll is actually entered and stuff. 284 00:11:23,150 --> 00:11:26,390 Once you get to a stage that you're paying people salaries and stuff, 285 00:11:26,390 --> 00:11:28,020 like you have a responsibility 286 00:11:28,020 --> 00:11:31,060 as a person in charge of that to your employees. 287 00:11:31,060 --> 00:11:33,150 They are legal concerns. 288 00:11:33,150 --> 00:11:35,460 I think one of the most interesting things is when I was interviewing people, 289 00:11:35,460 --> 00:11:38,280 I had to, like, step back and actually realize that, like, 290 00:11:38,280 --> 00:11:41,450 I have, like, a legal responsibility as a corporation 291 00:11:41,450 --> 00:11:43,820 in the United States, in California 292 00:11:43,820 --> 00:11:47,290 to treat a potential job applicant a certain way, 293 00:11:47,290 --> 00:11:50,050 and you just have to realize that you have these responsibilities 294 00:11:50,050 --> 00:11:52,960 that you might not know about or might not be used to, 295 00:11:52,960 --> 00:11:55,470 and they come in a number of different ways, 296 00:11:55,470 --> 00:11:57,510 and you just have to get used to it. 297 00:11:57,510 --> 00:11:59,060 >>Right, yeah, I think it's interesting, because a lot of people 298 00:11:59,060 --> 00:12:01,540 when they're going through all these pains when they starting a company, 299 00:12:01,540 --> 00:12:04,120 they look at companies like Milk or Digg, 300 00:12:04,120 --> 00:12:06,690 and they're like, "Oh," they probably didn't have anything, 301 00:12:06,690 --> 00:12:08,480 because you see successful companies, 302 00:12:08,480 --> 00:12:10,380 and you don't realize that they go through some of the same things 303 00:12:10,380 --> 00:12:12,550 that everyone goes through in start up companies. 304 00:12:12,550 --> 00:12:14,610 >>Oh, yeah, the hardest thing starting Milk was that 305 00:12:14,610 --> 00:12:16,430 we needed to figure out an idea, 306 00:12:16,430 --> 00:12:19,920 and we basically needed to--we knew we had a good team, 307 00:12:19,920 --> 00:12:22,250 and it was what do we want to commit to 308 00:12:22,250 --> 00:12:25,880 and I think the hardest thing in this ecosystem right now 309 00:12:25,880 --> 00:12:27,530 is that people want an idea, 310 00:12:27,530 --> 00:12:29,530 and they're scared of pivoting their company, 311 00:12:29,530 --> 00:12:31,430 so they commit to something so hard 312 00:12:31,430 --> 00:12:34,620 that, like, they won't change paths 313 00:12:34,620 --> 00:12:37,340 and there's kind of a stigma around the pivot 314 00:12:37,340 --> 00:12:39,560 that I don't think maybe their should be, 315 00:12:39,560 --> 00:12:41,750 because the most important thing is to just build something 316 00:12:41,750 --> 00:12:43,000 and if that doesn't work 317 00:12:43,000 --> 00:12:45,130 like, change what you're building, 318 00:12:45,130 --> 00:12:47,250 but don't sit there and not build anything. 319 00:12:47,250 --> 00:12:50,340 >>Okay, let's talk a little bit more about Laid Off Camp. 320 00:12:50,340 --> 00:12:53,730 Like, so it was 321 00:12:53,730 --> 00:12:55,230 pretty much national, right? 322 00:12:55,230 --> 00:12:57,440 You did it in multiple locations. 323 00:12:57,440 --> 00:12:59,210 What did you talk about there? 324 00:12:59,210 --> 00:13:01,470 Now this was pre-this recession. 325 00:13:01,470 --> 00:13:03,650 >>Yeah, this was late 2008. 326 00:13:03,650 --> 00:13:05,090 >>Yeah, what did you teach? 327 00:13:05,090 --> 00:13:07,360 Was it only tech stuff? 328 00:13:07,360 --> 00:13:09,340 >>No, so the interesting thing about Laid Off Camp 329 00:13:09,340 --> 00:13:11,280 was it was done in San Francisco. 330 00:13:11,280 --> 00:13:13,410 It was modeled after bar camp. 331 00:13:13,410 --> 00:13:17,030 It had a very strong influence on--from technology, 332 00:13:17,030 --> 00:13:19,560 but it was not a technology event at all. 333 00:13:19,560 --> 00:13:21,240 The general thesis was 334 00:13:21,240 --> 00:13:23,420 the economy was terrible. 335 00:13:23,420 --> 00:13:26,220 People were getting laid off pretty much every day, 336 00:13:26,220 --> 00:13:30,340 and people didn't have skills that they wanted. 337 00:13:30,340 --> 00:13:33,840 People would, like, complain and be like, "Oh, I can't get a job, I need skills." 338 00:13:33,840 --> 00:13:36,960 And traditional job training just wasn't working. 339 00:13:36,960 --> 00:13:40,380 And then there's also this whole freelance community in San Francisco 340 00:13:40,380 --> 00:13:44,260 that kind of--they're not laid off, but they don't have full-time jobs, 341 00:13:44,260 --> 00:13:46,710 so what I kind of wanted to great was a place 342 00:13:46,710 --> 00:13:49,580 for people without the kind of full-time job situation 343 00:13:49,580 --> 00:13:52,200 to come together and learn from each other. 344 00:13:52,200 --> 00:13:54,720 So when you show up in the morning, there's nothing on the agenda, 345 00:13:54,720 --> 00:13:56,770 but there's a giant white board 346 00:13:56,770 --> 00:13:58,320 with a bunch of rooms 347 00:13:58,320 --> 00:14:00,330 and a bunch of sticky notes, 348 00:14:00,330 --> 00:14:02,060 and you can get up and say, "You know what? 349 00:14:02,060 --> 00:14:04,410 I want to talk about Twitter; I know so much about Twitter, 350 00:14:04,410 --> 00:14:07,100 and I'm here to create a session about Twitter." 351 00:14:07,100 --> 00:14:10,690 And so the really cool dynamic that ended up happening was 352 00:14:10,690 --> 00:14:13,280 we had people in their 70s, 353 00:14:13,280 --> 00:14:15,350 and we had people in their 20s, 354 00:14:15,350 --> 00:14:18,690 and there was this one guy who probably, let's say early 50s 355 00:14:18,690 --> 00:14:20,970 who, his whole life, he was a hiring manager, 356 00:14:20,970 --> 00:14:22,450 so he probably interviewed 357 00:14:22,450 --> 00:14:25,770 hundreds and thousands of people his whole life, 358 00:14:25,770 --> 00:14:27,580 and he knew everything it took 359 00:14:27,580 --> 00:14:30,880 to kind of light up his eyes when he was interviewing someone. 360 00:14:30,880 --> 00:14:32,800 Nothing to do with technology, 361 00:14:32,800 --> 00:14:35,140 but so he led a session on how to interview 362 00:14:35,140 --> 00:14:37,280 and how to wow an interviewer. 363 00:14:37,280 --> 00:14:39,290 Similarly, there was, like, a 20-year-old kid 364 00:14:39,290 --> 00:14:43,010 who knew everything about Twitter and Facebook and LinkedIn and technology 365 00:14:43,010 --> 00:14:46,120 who was able to teach that guy, who knew nothing about tech, 366 00:14:46,120 --> 00:14:48,170 some skills and then likewise, 367 00:14:48,170 --> 00:14:50,310 that guy was able to teach the younger-- 368 00:14:50,310 --> 00:14:52,770 so basically, you had people that were learning from their peers 369 00:14:52,770 --> 00:14:55,770 instead of learning from me or someone else 370 00:14:55,770 --> 00:14:58,310 how to do anything. 371 00:14:58,310 --> 00:15:01,080 The sessions were--exactly. 372 00:15:01,080 --> 00:15:03,210 >>So a question for you. 373 00:15:03,210 --> 00:15:05,480 So since we're in an education space, 374 00:15:05,480 --> 00:15:07,340 like if I learn something from Treehouse, 375 00:15:07,340 --> 00:15:09,450 taking those skills and showing it to 376 00:15:09,450 --> 00:15:12,280 a company and saying, "Hey, I learned these things" 377 00:15:12,280 --> 00:15:14,580 without having an accreditation. 378 00:15:14,580 --> 00:15:16,850 Like how did Laid Off Camp 379 00:15:16,850 --> 00:15:19,140 take the skills that you taught people 380 00:15:19,140 --> 00:15:22,640 and, like, give them a way to show it to companies 381 00:15:22,640 --> 00:15:24,070 so that you can say, 382 00:15:24,070 --> 00:15:26,950 "Hey, I've learned these new skills now with Laid Off Camp." 383 00:15:26,950 --> 00:15:28,340 >>We didn't do stuff like that, 384 00:15:28,340 --> 00:15:30,350 but not--but I don't think we needed to, 385 00:15:30,350 --> 00:15:33,050 because when we hire an engineer at Milk, 386 00:15:33,050 --> 00:15:37,540 we weren't saying, "Show me your certification from some PHP seminar." 387 00:15:37,540 --> 00:15:39,570 We were saying, "Show me what you build." 388 00:15:39,570 --> 00:15:41,760 >>But see, that's easy with tech. 389 00:15:41,760 --> 00:15:43,440 You can build a product. 390 00:15:43,440 --> 00:15:45,170 What about some other start up? 391 00:15:45,170 --> 00:15:48,180 >>Exactly, so if I'm going to hire a BD person 392 00:15:48,180 --> 00:15:51,320 or an associate at Google Ventures, 393 00:15:51,320 --> 00:15:54,440 I don't care that they have 394 00:15:54,440 --> 00:15:56,920 experience doing BD; 395 00:15:56,920 --> 00:15:59,200 I care that they can use their BD skills, 396 00:15:59,200 --> 00:16:01,650 their hustle, their enthusiasm, their passion 397 00:16:01,650 --> 00:16:03,760 to convince me that I want to hire them. 398 00:16:03,760 --> 00:16:06,400 So I was going to 399 00:16:06,400 --> 00:16:08,040 SimpleGeo when I wanted a job, 400 00:16:08,040 --> 00:16:10,440 I pitched the founder; I tried to pitch one of their investors, 401 00:16:10,440 --> 00:16:12,320 I tried--I was using the kind of skills 402 00:16:12,320 --> 00:16:14,740 that I would need to have in that role 403 00:16:14,740 --> 00:16:16,290 to get the job, 404 00:16:16,290 --> 00:16:19,630 and so I think that if you want to show someone that you know how to interview, 405 00:16:19,630 --> 00:16:21,520 wow them in an interview. 406 00:16:21,520 --> 00:16:23,030 If you want to show them you know how to use Twitter, 407 00:16:23,030 --> 00:16:25,410 use Twitter well, and link them to your Twitter page 408 00:16:25,410 --> 00:16:28,000 The same thing applies in the business side, 409 00:16:28,000 --> 00:16:31,710 but you just have--it would be difficult for, like, an introverted person 410 00:16:31,710 --> 00:16:33,950 to be able to convince someone that they had all these skills 411 00:16:33,950 --> 00:16:36,120 unless they can demonstrate them. 412 00:16:36,120 --> 00:16:38,480 >>So moving on, let's talk about investing. 413 00:16:38,480 --> 00:16:41,410 What is it--what brought you to Google Venture--? 414 00:16:41,410 --> 00:16:43,650 >>Right there, let me pause you and say, 415 00:16:43,650 --> 00:16:45,650 So, the reason I'm at Google Ventures 416 00:16:45,650 --> 00:16:47,460 is because Milk, 417 00:16:47,460 --> 00:16:49,750 about 1 year after we started was approached by Google. 418 00:16:49,750 --> 00:16:51,680 We were at a point in time 419 00:16:51,680 --> 00:16:54,410 where we had built our first product. 420 00:16:54,410 --> 00:16:56,770 We kind of realized that product 421 00:16:56,770 --> 00:17:00,250 wasn't going to just be a break-out success 422 00:17:00,250 --> 00:17:03,260 that we needed to dedicate everything in company to, 423 00:17:03,260 --> 00:17:05,050 but we had also realized it had some legs 424 00:17:05,050 --> 00:17:07,130 and we weren't sure what to do. 425 00:17:07,130 --> 00:17:09,359 So we kind of started thinking, "What can we build next?" 426 00:17:09,359 --> 00:17:13,670 And during that same process of being unsure of what our next project was, 427 00:17:13,670 --> 00:17:15,450 we were approached by Google 428 00:17:15,450 --> 00:17:17,220 and kind of talked to Google about 429 00:17:17,220 --> 00:17:19,790 how could we work together? 430 00:17:19,790 --> 00:17:21,760 We had a lot of visions for how Google 431 00:17:21,760 --> 00:17:24,349 could improve social and mobile and all that. 432 00:17:24,349 --> 00:17:26,619 And so that conversation kept going, 433 00:17:26,619 --> 00:17:30,070 and eventually, the 4 of us from Milk joined Google. 434 00:17:30,070 --> 00:17:32,910 >>Okay, so that's what brought you to Google Ventures. 435 00:17:32,910 --> 00:17:35,970 >>So that brought the 4 of us to Google+. 436 00:17:35,970 --> 00:17:38,340 Google is a great company. 437 00:17:38,340 --> 00:17:42,260 Like, they really want everyone at the company to be happy. 438 00:17:42,260 --> 00:17:45,390 So genuinely, they kind of ask you, 439 00:17:45,390 --> 00:17:48,340 "You got acquired by Google+; you're working at Google+ right now. 440 00:17:48,340 --> 00:17:50,210 How do you feel?" 441 00:17:50,210 --> 00:17:54,560 And I was a PM, and I very much like to be out and about, being social 442 00:17:54,560 --> 00:17:57,880 and it turned out that a PM role wasn't the right fit for me. 443 00:17:57,880 --> 00:18:00,570 I love product and at a start up doing product is great, 444 00:18:00,570 --> 00:18:03,700 because there's a lot more that you do than just traditional product role. 445 00:18:03,700 --> 00:18:06,070 At Google, to be a great PM, 446 00:18:06,070 --> 00:18:09,290 you need to love writing PRD, 447 00:18:09,290 --> 00:18:11,280 and you need to really understand that, 448 00:18:11,280 --> 00:18:13,670 and I understood it, but I knew it wasn't my passion. 449 00:18:13,670 --> 00:18:15,250 So when I went to my manager 450 00:18:15,250 --> 00:18:18,130 and was like, "Hey, I've been talking to the Google Ventures guys. 451 00:18:18,130 --> 00:18:20,250 They invested in Milk. 452 00:18:20,250 --> 00:18:22,020 I love what they're doing." 453 00:18:22,020 --> 00:18:24,440 She was like, "That makes sense; why don't you do that?" 454 00:18:24,440 --> 00:18:28,300 >>So let's talk a little bit about structures like at Google Ventures. 455 00:18:28,300 --> 00:18:30,810 Like what do you guys do? 456 00:18:30,810 --> 00:18:33,360 >>Sure, so we're a pretty large firm, right? 457 00:18:33,360 --> 00:18:35,300 We have over 50 employees. 458 00:18:35,300 --> 00:18:38,950 We basically have an investing team 459 00:18:38,950 --> 00:18:40,610 of about 14 employees, 460 00:18:40,610 --> 00:18:42,430 and then we have a whole other team 461 00:18:42,430 --> 00:18:44,920 of different hands-on groups 462 00:18:44,920 --> 00:18:46,870 that help out our portfolio. 463 00:18:46,870 --> 00:18:48,720 We've got a design studio 464 00:18:48,720 --> 00:18:50,450 with 5 designers 465 00:18:50,450 --> 00:18:52,890 who basically, depending on the size of our company 466 00:18:52,890 --> 00:18:54,620 and how much we have invested, 467 00:18:54,620 --> 00:18:59,070 do everything from office hours, talking about design with our portfolio companies 468 00:18:59,070 --> 00:19:02,060 to actually helping prototype things out 469 00:19:02,060 --> 00:19:04,720 to sitting down with their designers and walking through UI flows. 470 00:19:04,720 --> 00:19:06,350 >>Okay, so very hands on. 471 00:19:06,350 --> 00:19:08,390 >>Very hands-on. 472 00:19:08,390 --> 00:19:11,660 We have a bunch of engineers from data modeling, 473 00:19:11,660 --> 00:19:13,960 machine learning, status, PHD. 474 00:19:13,960 --> 00:19:16,390 The goal is there's some of these areas like design 475 00:19:16,390 --> 00:19:18,890 and really heavy data modeling 476 00:19:18,890 --> 00:19:21,070 and recruiting, we have 5 recruiters 477 00:19:21,070 --> 00:19:23,220 that help our portfolio companies, 478 00:19:23,220 --> 00:19:25,210 where it's really hard for an early-stage company 479 00:19:25,210 --> 00:19:27,310 to dedicate a person 480 00:19:27,310 --> 00:19:29,280 or a head count to recruiting, 481 00:19:29,280 --> 00:19:32,090 and it's a huge thing that almost all of our portfolio companies need, 482 00:19:32,090 --> 00:19:35,260 so we found that as a way that we can provide a lot of value, 483 00:19:35,260 --> 00:19:37,960 because not everyone needs a full-time recruiter. 484 00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:39,010 So if we have 5, 485 00:19:39,010 --> 00:19:41,290 that can serve our entire portfolio. 486 00:19:41,290 --> 00:19:44,800 >>So you're a VC plus an incubator, essentially. 487 00:19:44,800 --> 00:19:48,170 >>I wouldn't say that we're an incubator, 488 00:19:48,170 --> 00:19:51,060 but we're a VC that offers a lot of the same value 489 00:19:51,060 --> 00:19:53,680 that an incubator would, yeah. 490 00:19:53,680 --> 00:19:56,050 >>When you guys invest, 491 00:19:56,050 --> 00:19:58,980 what do you look for in a founder or a team? 492 00:19:58,980 --> 00:20:01,320 What qualities make a good leader 493 00:20:01,320 --> 00:20:03,120 or, like, translate into a successful business? 494 00:20:03,120 --> 00:20:05,050 Now you don't have to get into Google strategies 495 00:20:05,050 --> 00:20:07,270 or have--specifically what you guys do. 496 00:20:07,270 --> 00:20:09,440 What in general? 497 00:20:09,440 --> 00:20:11,370 >>Yeah, so when I sit down with a founder 498 00:20:11,370 --> 00:20:14,510 which happens multiple times a day, 499 00:20:14,510 --> 00:20:16,950 I'm really looking for 500 00:20:16,950 --> 00:20:19,900 someone that is passionate about what they're doing, 501 00:20:19,900 --> 00:20:21,530 incredibly talented, 502 00:20:21,530 --> 00:20:24,680 put together a team that's capable of getting them to the next step. 503 00:20:24,680 --> 00:20:27,010 I'm not looking for a founder that's also 504 00:20:27,010 --> 00:20:30,850 necessarily going to be able to run the company when it's a $500 million company, 505 00:20:30,850 --> 00:20:32,160 but I'm looking for someone 506 00:20:32,160 --> 00:20:35,410 that's really able to do what they have-- 507 00:20:35,410 --> 00:20:38,400 tackle the challenge that they have at hand right now. 508 00:20:38,400 --> 00:20:41,140 Yeah, I've seen a couple of companies where it's just a business guy, 509 00:20:41,140 --> 00:20:43,660 and he has this dream of raising a million dollars 510 00:20:43,660 --> 00:20:46,250 and hiring engineers, 511 00:20:46,250 --> 00:20:49,050 and I'm typically looking for the person that's already found a team 512 00:20:49,050 --> 00:20:51,280 that can build what they want to build, 513 00:20:51,280 --> 00:20:53,480 and usually that's already built something. 514 00:20:53,480 --> 00:20:55,790 There's nothing more amazing 515 00:20:55,790 --> 00:20:57,510 than going to a meeting 516 00:20:57,510 --> 00:21:00,080 and someone saying, "Here's my app; play with it," 517 00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:02,900 and like, it's not trying to decide 518 00:21:02,900 --> 00:21:04,050 what it could be; 519 00:21:04,050 --> 00:21:07,170 it's decide what it is, and the cost of building something. 520 00:21:07,170 --> 00:21:10,500 So you guys at Treehouse know you're teaching people 521 00:21:10,500 --> 00:21:13,020 how to build products all the time, 522 00:21:13,020 --> 00:21:15,440 different coding languages, different platforms. 523 00:21:15,440 --> 00:21:17,460 Because that's so easy, all it takes is your time. 524 00:21:17,460 --> 00:21:20,350 And so you can build something tangible that I can play with. 525 00:21:20,350 --> 00:21:22,220 Half the time, some of the pitches, they just say, 526 00:21:22,220 --> 00:21:24,370 "Here's my site. 527 00:21:24,370 --> 00:21:26,240 Like, let's talk about it if you're interested," 528 00:21:26,240 --> 00:21:29,170 and I can just go use their app; I don't even meet them at the first step. 529 00:21:29,170 --> 00:21:31,480 And so that's really important. 530 00:21:31,480 --> 00:21:33,450 So I love being able to see the product, 531 00:21:33,450 --> 00:21:35,800 and I love being able to really just understand the passion 532 00:21:35,800 --> 00:21:37,570 that comes with the entrepreneur. 533 00:21:37,570 --> 00:21:39,040 >>Okay, so how do people 534 00:21:39,040 --> 00:21:41,350 get in touch with you or any investor in general? 535 00:21:41,350 --> 00:21:44,130 Like, should people network their way up? 536 00:21:44,130 --> 00:21:46,590 Or find you through a contact 537 00:21:46,590 --> 00:21:48,370 or should people just e-mail you things? 538 00:21:48,370 --> 00:21:50,960 >>So what's the most effective way? 539 00:21:50,960 --> 00:21:54,390 >>So the most effect--in start up business, life, anything; 540 00:21:54,390 --> 00:21:57,990 like, the most effective skill someone who's running something, 541 00:21:57,990 --> 00:22:00,780 whether it's a company or anything, 542 00:22:00,780 --> 00:22:03,710 the ability to network, to hustle, and to be-- 543 00:22:03,710 --> 00:22:05,690 that's important. 544 00:22:05,690 --> 00:22:07,850 So if I get an e-mail from a friend that says, 545 00:22:07,850 --> 00:22:09,730 "You have to talk to this guy," 546 00:22:09,730 --> 00:22:12,150 I'm going to respond a lot faster than if I get an e-mail 547 00:22:12,150 --> 00:22:15,610 that was sent to 100 people, 548 00:22:15,610 --> 00:22:17,010 that's not even personalized to me, 549 00:22:17,010 --> 00:22:18,920 and it was sent out. 550 00:22:18,920 --> 00:22:20,410 The same thing goes when you're trying to find a job. 551 00:22:20,410 --> 00:22:23,860 You can sent 100 resumes to 100 different companies, 552 00:22:23,860 --> 00:22:25,170 or you can pick 3 companies 553 00:22:25,170 --> 00:22:27,910 and do everything you can to get in. 554 00:22:27,910 --> 00:22:30,430 And that's--when I decided I wanted to work at a start up, 555 00:22:30,430 --> 00:22:33,310 I picked 1 company and did everything I can to get a job there. 556 00:22:33,310 --> 00:22:35,430 I didn't even interview with any other company. 557 00:22:35,430 --> 00:22:38,410 >>Right, so, 558 00:22:38,410 --> 00:22:40,060 so you said, like, 559 00:22:40,060 --> 00:22:45,110 you're looking for someone with passion, with the ability to get the task done. 560 00:22:45,110 --> 00:22:47,670 Does that have to be--what if it's a business guy 561 00:22:47,670 --> 00:22:50,680 with a--trying to start a technical company. 562 00:22:50,680 --> 00:22:53,350 Doesn't have technical skills. 563 00:22:53,350 --> 00:22:55,430 Because the stigma in this day and age 564 00:22:55,430 --> 00:22:57,300 is you need to be able to build your own product. 565 00:22:57,300 --> 00:22:59,170 One of the things we talked about often is 566 00:22:59,170 --> 00:23:02,450 should founders be able to code? 567 00:23:02,450 --> 00:23:04,890 And--so what if a founder comes to you who can't code 568 00:23:04,890 --> 00:23:06,370 but is super passionate? 569 00:23:06,370 --> 00:23:08,420 Does that come across as a positive thing? 570 00:23:08,420 --> 00:23:10,620 >>So I'll take myself as an example. 571 00:23:10,620 --> 00:23:13,380 I know sometime in the future, I'll probably start another company. 572 00:23:13,380 --> 00:23:15,340 Maybe it'll be technical. 573 00:23:15,340 --> 00:23:19,360 Maybe, in the future, we do things that I can't even predict, right? 574 00:23:19,360 --> 00:23:22,880 But I know if I were going to pitch a VC right now, 575 00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:25,340 saying, "Hey, I want to start this company," 576 00:23:25,340 --> 00:23:27,880 I would feel ill prepared 577 00:23:27,880 --> 00:23:29,750 if I didn't have someone on my team 578 00:23:29,750 --> 00:23:31,940 who was able to build what I wanted 579 00:23:31,940 --> 00:23:33,480 So similarly, 580 00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:36,510 I think that if I have a passionate business 581 00:23:36,510 --> 00:23:38,630 co-founder come and meet with me 582 00:23:38,630 --> 00:23:40,750 and he was like, "I have this great idea," 583 00:23:40,750 --> 00:23:43,090 my advice to them would be, 584 00:23:43,090 --> 00:23:45,150 why don't you go find someone you can work with 585 00:23:45,150 --> 00:23:47,490 and build your product with, 586 00:23:47,490 --> 00:23:51,010 because it's important that you have that team in place. 587 00:23:51,010 --> 00:23:53,190 Money doesn't solve the ability to meet someone, 588 00:23:53,190 --> 00:23:56,100 so you're not at a stage where money gets you to the next step, 589 00:23:56,100 --> 00:23:58,440 because the next step, you don't need any money. 590 00:23:58,440 --> 00:24:00,080 >>Right, you just need to find someone. 591 00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:02,460 Okay, once--say that I found a VC or an investor, 592 00:24:02,460 --> 00:24:04,750 what is the best way for me to get my idea across 593 00:24:04,750 --> 00:24:06,780 and convince them that I'm worth investing in? 594 00:24:06,780 --> 00:24:08,830 You know, usually you need a business plan. 595 00:24:08,830 --> 00:24:10,250 You need financial projections. 596 00:24:10,250 --> 00:24:12,270 You need a model. 597 00:24:12,270 --> 00:24:14,290 >>So in the old days, that was true. 598 00:24:14,290 --> 00:24:16,400 I would say 599 00:24:16,400 --> 00:24:19,220 I have never seriously considered a company 600 00:24:19,220 --> 00:24:21,050 that sent me a business plan 601 00:24:21,050 --> 00:24:24,870 with financial models, forecasts, projections at the seed stage. 602 00:24:24,870 --> 00:24:26,710 So at Google Ventures, we kind of do 603 00:24:26,710 --> 00:24:28,020 seed investing, 604 00:24:28,020 --> 00:24:30,180 which is what the team I'm on, 605 00:24:30,180 --> 00:24:31,710 and then we do tons of other investing 606 00:24:31,710 --> 00:24:33,180 at series A to series Z, 607 00:24:33,180 --> 00:24:35,870 all the way up and down the timeline of a company. 608 00:24:35,870 --> 00:24:37,400 At the seed stage, 609 00:24:37,400 --> 00:24:39,820 if someone's giving me financial projections, 610 00:24:39,820 --> 00:24:42,930 they basically mean nothing. 611 00:24:42,930 --> 00:24:44,750 So I'm not even looking for them. 612 00:24:44,750 --> 00:24:47,370 Sometimes the companies don't even know how they're going to make money, 613 00:24:47,370 --> 00:24:49,780 let alone how much they're going to make 5 years from now. 614 00:24:49,780 --> 00:24:52,120 The concept of a business plan 615 00:24:52,120 --> 00:24:55,650 and putting together an executive summary is similar, right? 616 00:24:55,650 --> 00:24:59,630 When someone mails me a 5-page business plan executive summary, 617 00:24:59,630 --> 00:25:01,750 I just kind of think this person doesn't get it, 618 00:25:01,750 --> 00:25:04,040 because right now, what I want, 619 00:25:04,040 --> 00:25:07,260 I mean, if I were to craft the perfect e-mail that someone would send me, 620 00:25:07,260 --> 00:25:09,390 it would be, "Here's who my team is," 621 00:25:09,390 --> 00:25:11,280 in 1 to 2 sentences, 622 00:25:11,280 --> 00:25:13,850 "Here's what we're building," in 1 to 2 sentences. 623 00:25:13,850 --> 00:25:17,350 That 1 to 2 sentences needs to address the problem they're solving. 624 00:25:17,350 --> 00:25:20,060 I don't want to hear that you're building Pinterest for cats, 625 00:25:20,060 --> 00:25:22,820 unless you have a strong reason 626 00:25:22,820 --> 00:25:25,790 why Pinterest for cats is something that the world needs, 627 00:25:25,790 --> 00:25:28,220 which I don't think it is right now. 628 00:25:28,220 --> 00:25:31,350 I'm always looking for 629 00:25:31,350 --> 00:25:34,290 someone to say very concisely 630 00:25:34,290 --> 00:25:37,260 who we are, what we're doing, and what problem we're solving, 631 00:25:37,260 --> 00:25:39,360 and if they can do that in a few sentences 632 00:25:39,360 --> 00:25:41,520 and attach a link to a product, 633 00:25:41,520 --> 00:25:43,840 a link to a demo, a deck, 634 00:25:43,840 --> 00:25:45,520 anything at the beginning, 635 00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:48,220 it just makes it easier for me, 636 00:25:48,220 --> 00:25:51,520 because if someone sends, "Hey, I've got an idea; I'd love to share it with you," 637 00:25:51,520 --> 00:25:53,060 then it's on me to say, 638 00:25:53,060 --> 00:25:55,280 "Okay, will you share it with me." 639 00:25:55,280 --> 00:25:57,300 Then they say, "Here it is" 640 00:25:57,300 --> 00:25:59,300 >>Right, so initiated that conversation yourself. 641 00:25:59,300 --> 00:26:02,300 >>Absolutely; once I have it, I can go look at it-- 642 00:26:02,300 --> 00:26:04,530 chances are, if you send me a deck, I'll read it. 643 00:26:04,530 --> 00:26:07,250 If you send me a deck, and I read it, 644 00:26:07,250 --> 00:26:09,650 and it's just crazy, and I have no idea who you are, 645 00:26:09,650 --> 00:26:12,330 like that much lowers the likelihood 646 00:26:12,330 --> 00:26:14,570 that I'm going to react quickly. 647 00:26:14,570 --> 00:26:16,620 So definitely get an intro, 648 00:26:16,620 --> 00:26:19,690 but also be proactive and be prepared 649 00:26:19,690 --> 00:26:22,610 so that the person reading your e-mail can do everything they want to do, 650 00:26:22,610 --> 00:26:24,410 which is evaluate your company. 651 00:26:24,410 --> 00:26:27,340 >>Right, okay, and now to wrap it up, a final question: 652 00:26:27,340 --> 00:26:29,640 A lot of people out there have ideas. 653 00:26:29,640 --> 00:26:31,360 What advice do you have to those people? 654 00:26:31,360 --> 00:26:33,310 Because you started companies, 655 00:26:33,310 --> 00:26:35,260 and now you're in the place where you help companies. 656 00:26:35,260 --> 00:26:37,180 So do you have any advice to those people 657 00:26:37,180 --> 00:26:39,270 to take that idea, and execute on it? 658 00:26:39,270 --> 00:26:41,120 >>So ideas are kind of a commodity, right? 659 00:26:41,120 --> 00:26:43,450 Like you probably came up with 5 ideas today 660 00:26:43,450 --> 00:26:45,300 of things that, "Oh, this doesn't work." 661 00:26:45,300 --> 00:26:47,180 So instead of an idea, 662 00:26:47,180 --> 00:26:49,280 I love when people come to me with problems. 663 00:26:49,280 --> 00:26:52,950 So that's the first step, "I have an idea. 664 00:26:52,950 --> 00:26:54,480 It would be really cool if 665 00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:58,150 I could use my phone to send a text message in the shower, 666 00:26:58,150 --> 00:27:00,220 because maybe sometimes I remember something." 667 00:27:00,220 --> 00:27:03,950 So the idea stems from the problem that I want to do it, 668 00:27:03,950 --> 00:27:07,110 but then think about, is this a problem people can really have? 669 00:27:07,110 --> 00:27:09,000 There are a lot of times where I'm like, "This would be so cool!" 670 00:27:09,000 --> 00:27:11,150 And then I'm like, "Do people really need this?" 671 00:27:11,150 --> 00:27:14,400 So the first step is vet your idea to make sure it actually solves a problem 672 00:27:14,400 --> 00:27:16,370 that lots of people have 673 00:27:16,370 --> 00:27:18,250 that people are willing to pay for. 674 00:27:18,250 --> 00:27:21,290 If you can create a business out of the idea 675 00:27:21,290 --> 00:27:23,380 and solve a problem, 676 00:27:23,380 --> 00:27:25,330 then it's probably an idea worth pursuing. 677 00:27:25,330 --> 00:27:27,670 >>Right; not to cut you off, but with ideas, 678 00:27:27,670 --> 00:27:29,590 you need to kind of gage the success, 679 00:27:29,590 --> 00:27:31,300 and a lot of people are secretive about it. 680 00:27:31,300 --> 00:27:33,440 Do you recommend sharing ideas? 681 00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:36,830 >>So every now and then, I get an e-mail with someone asking me sign an NDA, 682 00:27:36,830 --> 00:27:39,170 and you probably won't find a single investo 683 00:27:39,170 --> 00:27:41,040 that will sign an NDA, 684 00:27:41,040 --> 00:27:43,600 and if they will, they're probably not the kind of investor 685 00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:46,110 that really gets the space. 686 00:27:46,110 --> 00:27:48,310 Mostly because we see so many ideas. 687 00:27:48,310 --> 00:27:50,550 I can't agree to 1 company 688 00:27:50,550 --> 00:27:52,640 that I'm not going to know what they're doing-- 689 00:27:52,640 --> 00:27:55,620 We have our reputation based on the fact that 690 00:27:55,620 --> 00:27:58,180 we don't share pitches with other people. 691 00:27:58,180 --> 00:28:00,580 But to go through the paperwork of having our legal team, 692 00:28:00,580 --> 00:28:02,510 it's just never going to happen. 693 00:28:02,510 --> 00:28:05,480 Similarly, the idea isn't what I'm investing in. 694 00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:07,630 I would say there's not a single company 695 00:28:07,630 --> 00:28:09,850 that I've ever thought of or invested in 696 00:28:09,850 --> 00:28:12,040 or thought of investing in or invested in 697 00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:15,180 because of the idea they had; it's who they are. 698 00:28:15,180 --> 00:28:17,460 So share your idea; 699 00:28:17,460 --> 00:28:20,260 don't share it to someone you think might go built it 700 00:28:20,260 --> 00:28:23,270 and try to do it--do it better than you, 701 00:28:23,270 --> 00:28:26,410 and if you think they could, work with them. 702 00:28:26,410 --> 00:28:28,350 But the general idea is 703 00:28:28,350 --> 00:28:30,310 share your ideas with people to get feedback, 704 00:28:30,310 --> 00:28:32,540 but don't share it to the world, 705 00:28:32,540 --> 00:28:35,910 but don't be afraid of requiring people to sign NDAs or anything. 706 00:28:35,910 --> 00:28:37,930 At the end of the day, 707 00:28:37,930 --> 00:28:40,400 what's going to be successful is your passion about this idea. 708 00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:43,510 You are the one--that's who investors are going to bet on. 709 00:28:43,510 --> 00:28:46,340 So to finish the previous thought, 710 00:28:46,340 --> 00:28:49,440 it's make sure you're sharing it with the right people, 711 00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:51,570 get lots of feedback, 712 00:28:51,570 --> 00:28:53,730 and then if in anyway possible, 713 00:28:53,730 --> 00:28:55,460 build something. 714 00:28:55,460 --> 00:28:58,340 I don't care if--there's this great app called Prototypes 715 00:28:58,340 --> 00:29:00,840 that lets you take a bunch of pictures 716 00:29:00,840 --> 00:29:03,340 and create links between pictures 717 00:29:03,340 --> 00:29:05,610 by touch. 718 00:29:05,610 --> 00:29:07,970 You can pull it up on your iPhone, and it acts like an app, right? 719 00:29:07,970 --> 00:29:09,350 You can jump from page to page to page, 720 00:29:09,350 --> 00:29:11,190 you can interact with it, 721 00:29:11,190 --> 00:29:14,150 except all it is is pictures with, like, links at different parts of the pictures 722 00:29:14,150 --> 00:29:16,440 that all work together. 723 00:29:16,440 --> 00:29:18,270 You don't have to be technical to do that, 724 00:29:18,270 --> 00:29:21,960 but it lets me, the investor, understand what you're doing. 725 00:29:21,960 --> 00:29:24,890 I'll probably want to see that you can build it before I'd invest, 726 00:29:24,890 --> 00:29:28,580 but it would definitely help me vet an idea 10 times faster 727 00:29:28,580 --> 00:29:30,270 than you just saying it. 728 00:29:30,270 --> 00:29:33,160 >>Right, and then now, in this economy, and with you having experience, 729 00:29:33,160 --> 00:29:36,470 dealing with Laid Off Camp, 730 00:29:36,470 --> 00:29:38,970 what advice do you have to people 731 00:29:38,970 --> 00:29:41,350 who are trying to build a company in this economy? 732 00:29:41,350 --> 00:29:43,280 >>This is a great time to build a company, right? 733 00:29:43,280 --> 00:29:46,140 There's a lot more investors than there had been. 734 00:29:46,140 --> 00:29:49,540 There's a lot of resources; there's incubators and accelerators all over the country, 735 00:29:49,540 --> 00:29:51,620 all over the world. 736 00:29:51,620 --> 00:29:55,380 People are starting to become more entrepreneurial. 737 00:29:55,380 --> 00:30:00,000 You see a decline in college students wanting to go get a regular corporate job. 738 00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:03,410 So it's a great time to meet co-founders, to start companies. 739 00:30:03,410 --> 00:30:07,650 Customers are now a whole lot more open, I think, to buying from small companies 740 00:30:07,650 --> 00:30:10,430 than just always buying at the Walmart or something like that. 741 00:30:10,430 --> 00:30:12,440 So I think that my advice to people is 742 00:30:12,440 --> 00:30:14,490 if you're passionate about it, go for it, right? 743 00:30:14,490 --> 00:30:17,030 Like there's--you can sit, 744 00:30:17,030 --> 00:30:20,490 and I've done this, and debate whether this is worth doing, 745 00:30:20,490 --> 00:30:23,230 but the people that can get over that 746 00:30:23,230 --> 00:30:25,930 and just do and the people--I always tell companies 747 00:30:25,930 --> 00:30:28,040 if they're thinking, "Oh, we're not sure if this is the right thing," 748 00:30:28,040 --> 00:30:30,990 and I'm like, "Just keep doing something; don't stop." 749 00:30:30,990 --> 00:30:32,420 The people that don't stop 750 00:30:32,420 --> 00:30:35,170 and the people that get over the fear of starting something 751 00:30:35,170 --> 00:30:37,220 or the fear of if they're doing the right thing; 752 00:30:37,220 --> 00:30:40,030 those are the people that end up doing amazing things. 753 00:30:40,030 --> 00:30:42,450 >>All right, Chris; I think that's all we have for today. 754 00:30:42,450 --> 00:30:44,110 Thank you for your time. 755 00:30:44,110 --> 00:30:48,450 [Treehouse Friends]