Does Treehouse need more usability testing?

I can't speak for how Treehouse handles the testing of there courses, but I do know that they put a lot of time into testing them out. Sometimes it isn't until you present a project as open to all users that some bugs will be discovered, as Steve Krug has often argued, you only really need 3-5 users at most to account for 85%~ of usability issues. It would be cool though to know if there was screen recording sessions (I'm sure they do it to some degree).

As far as design is concerned, no amount of courses are ever going to fully train designers for the real world. There are far too many situations that arise specifically from the client communication phases and having set deadlines as well as balancing other clients all factor into the process as well. It takes years and years of designing things, being mentored, critiqued, and even then only a certain level of taste can really ever be achieved. That taste level is the "artist" part of design, it is the je ne sais quoi of a designer.

All projects have specific needs based on the business, customers, current rends, and brand aesthetics as well. You can teach people how to ask the right questions, but making those decisions comes with a lot of knowledge uncovered through hard work. I do however think that there is plenty of room to create limited seating courses where people can sign up and work with a non-profit and work together to build them something real. I'm not sure how these would exist but it could really set Treehouse apart from the competition.

Back to the usability issues, I think that TH has done a great job of taking into account the UX and usability of the site. There are still several issues that plague it, such as the View Challenge button opening into a new tab, and not being able to go to the specific question/challenge referenced, as well as the occasional poor color palette choices and limited CC on courses (that should be red flagged and fixed ASAP).

Hi Luke, Thanks for the answer.

You said:

"I do however think that there is plenty of room to create limited seating courses where people can sign up and work with a non-profit and work together to build them something real."

I agree with this comment (along with most of what you said).

At one time Nancy King hinted at such job placement (even at the level of internships...possibly at non-profits).

Since then it seems like Treehouse just doesn't want to be involved with job placement at all.

Yes, as you say, in regard to the Treehouse site "UX and usability"

there are "still several issues that plague it.."

I noticed (glaringly) all those that you specifically mentioned and more...

I have emailed the support teams so many times

it's pretty much my most used bookmark for Treehouse

(it's almost on "speed dial").

The Treehouse page I most care about is my profile page

(because I send it to potential employers all the time).

Right now, in Firefox, the menus on the right end up get "cut off" (overlaid by another div).

This not only reflects poorly on me. but Treehouse as well.

I can deal with the fact that the challenge pages are messed up.

How so?

For me, using my desktop version of Firefox under Windows, if I scroll down

it doesn't let me use my mouse to insert text.

Instead my "workaround" involves clicking on the first line of the answer window and

then using the keyboard arrows to (tediously) scroll down to the insertion point

within the answer window in order to add the needed challenge code.

However no one but me (and the other Treehouse subscribers) have to deal with this

so it's kind of an "internal" problem.

Public profile pages are "external facing" and should probably get the most attention

for those inside Teamtreehouse who are constantly trying to improve the Treehouse UIX.

Instead of fixing issues, I instead see them doing things like

adding videos in the challenges and I'm thinking:

"Please fix the existing issues before trying to introduce new features!"

I want every course to be guaranteed to have .srt (video transcript) files.

I want every course to be required to have teachers notes and a download zip

file for the course code.

I want every course developer at Treehouse to actively consider

(while they are developing their course), the question of:

"what constitutes good design"?

If the course is a server side programming course then good design might have

an aside dealing with different types of design patterns for code.

If the course deals with front end development then it should offer

multiple options for how the web page could be styled and laid out.

Here's a radical idea:

How about having an actual real "in studio" audience as the course is being filmed

so there could be (included in the course) a filmed Q & A session at the end

that can pick up on some of the material that could be further

elucidated on --maybe offer a contrasting or alternate solution to that which the course offers...

Is there only one "perfect" way to code things?

Is there only one "perfect" way to design a web page?

Be more open to the breadth of possibilities inherent in the creative process

(and have the Treehouse UIX try to show off as wide a swath of these

working techniques as possible).

Ah I think I get more of what you are saying now, and I agree completely about the design aspect. There was a question earlier that was raised about using passwords in JavaScript in an insecure way, and I've seen other courses explain things in a simple way without really considering the ramifications of doing so. Plenty of books do this but the big BUT is that they also make sure to show how to do it the right way and why.

I'm still amazed at how many times I have come across courses that never had CC/transcripts for them which is really bad, especially in an industry that preaches so much about inclusivity and accessibility. Some of the features you've mentioned have been raised numerous times, often without a word from anyone at TH. Yes they could email support, and sometimes I do see green posters in here, but it isn't very reassuring sometimes.

It is good though that there are people such as yourself who are on here a lot, (a lot.. how did you even get that many points?), who genuinely care about making things here better for everyone. You're one of the few people who pop in regularly here as well. Hopefully there are people lurking in here reading this and realizing how important a lot of these feature requests are, especially from a UX standpoint.

Treehouse seems to be changing a lot, WordPress being dropped eventually (a huge mistake in my opinion) and the hyper-focusing of specific technologies. Pluralsight was exactly like that when it first came out and was the reason I dropped it. Now it seems they are switching with each other.

Who knows maybe if we send enough emails, Ryan Carson will fly us down there and let us help out somehow? :)

Hi Luke,

Thanks for your additional reply (and keeping an eye of this thread).

I hope others eventually find it as well..

You said:

"Some of the features you've mentioned have been raised numerous times, often without a word from anyone at TH"

I appreciate you taking note of this (especially being a moderator).

Sometimes if feels like I'm a lone voice crying out in the wilderness...

You said:

"..how did you even get that many points?), who genuinely care about making things here better for everyone."

I got that many points because I do care and I'm very systematic in the way I approach things.

I am a person of very great perseverance and persistence --sometimes very stubbornly so..

I take the risk being labelled a "complainer" because I feel someone has to speak up

or none of the issues that I see as an "outsider" will ever end up rising to the priority level

that they get the attention they need to be addressed internally at TH.

You said:

"Treehouse seems to be changing a lot, WordPress being dropped eventually

(a huge mistake in my opinion) and the hyper-focusing of specific technologies."

Again, we are in total agreement.

Zac (the poor guy..I'm sorry he got canned), really never got deep enough into customizing Wordpress.

.

I since started doing my own WP embeds (including custom controls) and

have "pushed the envelope" to go to the cutting edge of what Customizr

can accomplish to allow every part of my custom themes to be radically changed after it's installed.

.

The 'the hyper-focusing of specific technologies' (and yet not going back to "fill in the gaps") is,

I believe, a result of TeamTreehouse's unique management structure (or lack thereof):

http://www.oregonlive.com/silicon-forest/index.ssf/2013/12/portland_startup_treehouse_eli.html

http://ryancarson.com/post/61562761297/no-managers-why-we-removed-bosses-at-treehouse

http://blog.teamtreehouse.com/working-in-a-flat-company

The downside of this is there is no one to:

1.) Demand followup - not only dotting the "i"s and crossing the "t"s,

but telling the workers their productivity

(as well as the quality of their work) is not just up to what it should be.

2.) Give feedback to the owner that the "worker bees" aren't getting the resources they need

(and/or maybe provide the "push" to hire more people if keeping up with business competitors demands it).

3.) Push for innovation, yet not allow it to get in the way of maintenance.

Someone needs to say "No" every once in a while to trying new things until

the old things (like going back to "patch" courses and solve site UIX issues) get resolved.

Here's another way of looking at things --your customer base (the Treehouse

subscribers) are your most valuable asset.

You've got hundreds of thousands of subscribers...people who in many cases

have not inconsequential technical skills,

as not only your "captive audience" but as potential open source contributors (! ).

Do to Treehouse's incredibly poor record of providing them job placement,

many of them are either out of work or only working part time,

and so might be able to contribute to Treehouse's success in unique and surprising ways,

if they are only asked.

There have been a few threads that have tried to get subscribers/student involved in different Treehouse

projects, but far too few in my humble opinion.

If nothing else - survey, survey, survey.

Let the students/subscribers be "part of the conversation" and help guide the priorities for

what gets prioritized internally at Treehouse.

However, if that is too much to ask, I'd settle for a "issues tracking" sub-forum at this point.

I've seen the "let's hide it until we figure out how to fix it" protocol played out at Treehouse

(shoving things off on the Treehouse support people) and sometimes

the results have turned out not-so-swell.

It's better to do such things "in the light" (out in the open)

instead of keeping 'maintenance' processes hidden away behind the scenes.

That has always been my agile/scrum/github experience.

Ryan Carson can be part of the solution, but in the end he shouldn't have to "helicopter" in

response to emails whenever the waters get choppy.

He just needs to work on directing the setup of better cybernetic feedback systems

that allow "outsiders" (students/subscribers) to join with internal Teamtreehouse personnel to

make Treehouse the best online learning experience possible.

Anyway..as always I could go on, but I'll stop there for now..

Old thread, but goodie. It's been two years since this conversation, but I think Treehouse hasn't changed enough. One consideration I would love to see from instructors is the idea of how people learn. We are all visual learners. For example, making more use of animations when teaching a topic rather than being so spontaneous about it. Sometimes you'll get an animation to explain a complex process, sometimes you won't. Even simple things like, when introducing a new term, write it out on the screen—not only will it help students grasp never before heard terminology on industry topics, but it makes us better at recalling these terms on the quizzes. There's an ENTIRE psychology to learning!

Which brings up a related topic, why isn't there a UX psychology course on Treehouse yet?? Is there?

Yea, I hope I'm not alone in saying that, although there are obviously real people working behind the scenes and customer support exists, at the same time Treehouse feels almost vacant. Almost as if there isn't enough engagement with student learning or that things are moving around and improving. Treehouse is a site and it just...exists.