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CSS How to Make a Website Styling Web Pages and Navigation Build Navigation with Unordered Lists

simon buysse
simon buysse
9,716 Points

Why does the float: left declaration remove white space above the header?

So I've played around a bit with the css rules to figure out how this positioning actually works. What is interesting is that none of the margin & padding properties seems to remove the whitespace above the header! The rule that actually removes the whitespace above the header is

header { float: left; }

Now that's unclear to me how that works...

6 Answers

Hi Simon, this looks to me like the margin is collapsing. Read here and here.

This does not happen with floating elements, as in your case. In particular, this rule applies: "The top margin of an in-flow block element collapses with its first in-flow block-level child's top margin if the element has no top border, no top padding, and the child has no clearance."

Regards,

Martin

Sam Baines
Sam Baines
4,315 Points

Hi Simon - if you post the code (both html & css) you are working with maybe someone can help you understand it a bit better.

simon buysse
simon buysse
9,716 Points

Hi Sam, I'm kind of new but I'll try to present it as clear as possible:

In my HTML file I declare a header which contains 2 headlines and a navigation bar.

<header>
      <a href="index.html" id="logo">
        <h1>Simon Buysse</h1>
        <h2>Front-end Web Developer</h2>
      </a>
      <nav>
        <ul>
          <li><a href="index.html" class="selected">Portfolio</a></li>
          <li><a href="about.html">About</a></li>
          <li><a href="contact.html">Contact</a></li>
        </ul>
      </nav>
    </header>

Without any CSS rule, this would create a whitespace above the header as we can see in this image:

alt text

What I think is strange is that this whitespace dissapears when you add a float property to the header element, even when we don't change the margins!

alt text

Sam Baines
Sam Baines
4,315 Points

Hi Simon - you are correct in the fact that the float property will remove that whitespace (maybe someone can explain the reason for this further but its probably something to do with the fact that it pushes the parent element around more). However I found with your code that the other issue causing the whitespace was actually the margin on the h1 element - check out this Codepen and have a play with the values. This example has no whitespace and doesn't use the float property, which is probably a better way to work with the css. Hope this helps.

Sam Baines
Sam Baines
4,315 Points

In thinking about this - using the float property, it probably ignores the h1 element when floating to the left and therefore clears the whitespace, again though im not 100% sure on that.

simon buysse
simon buysse
9,716 Points

Hi Martin, With what elements margin would it be collapsing then? Even when all top margins of every child element is set to 0, there is still that whitespace. Sam, also the h1 has no margin right now and still there is that whitespace that gets cleared when adding the float property. Here's my CSS code

/*  **********************
GENERAL
*********************** */
body{
  margin: 0;
  padding: 0;
  font-family:'Open Sans', sans-serif;
}

a{
  text-decoration: none;
}

img{
  max-width: 100%;
}


/*  **********************
HEADING
*********************** */
header{
  /*float: left;*/
  width: 100%;
  /*margin: 0 0 30px 0;*/
  /*padding: 5px 0 0 0;*/
  }

/*this wraps around the headers*/
#logo{
  text-align: center;
  margin: 0;
}

h1{
  font-family:'Changa One', sans-serif;
  /*margin: 15px 0;*/
  font-size: 1.75em;
  line-height: 0.8em;
  font-weight: normal;
}

h2{
  font-size:0.75em;
  font-weight: normal;
}

/*  **********************
NAVIGATION
*********************** */
nav{
  text-align: center;
  padding: 10px 0;
  /*margin: 20px 0 0;*/
}

nav ul{
  list-style: none;
  /*take away the margin on top of the ul element, the 10px doesn't change anything as far as I can tell*/
  margin: 0 10px;
  padding: 0;
}

nav li{
  display: inline-block;
}

/*The padding will make it possible to click next to the link and still click correctly*/
nav a{
  font-weight: 800;
  padding: 15px 10px;
}

The h1 element has some bottom and top margin by default. Set it to zero and see what happens.

Look at this pen.

Sam Baines
Sam Baines
4,315 Points

The same exact problem is still occuring with the h1 element simon - again check out this Codepen using your css but with some additional margin properties in the h1 element.

Simon, if you comment out in Sam's last pen the declarations for padding in the header selector and the one for the margin in the h1 selector, is the result what you see with your code? Because that does look very much like a collapsing margin.

simon buysse
simon buysse
9,716 Points

Awesome! Thank you so much for the help Sam & Martin! I've got a much better understanding of what is happening right now :)